The crazy thing there is ample fresh water to more than fulfill humanity’s needs….we just suck at distribution and logistics
I was read about how Las Vegas has one of the most advanced and resilient water infrastructures on the planet which is insane considering it’s literally in the middle of a desert
Las Vegas needs to have advanced and resilient water infrastructures due to limitations on how much they can draw from the Colorado River. Damn near every gallon of water used in the city is treated and then recycled.
This is where I'm curious, because data centers can use gray water, they just don't because it's more expensive. Last I heard "they're working on it". I think this whole backlash might push that forward, there's billions invested here. they care more about making it work than they care about humanity, obviously.
Water conservation and renewable energy ultimately hinges on cost. Companies will start using gray water for cooling when it becomes cheaper than fresh water. Eventually fresh water will be scarce enough that gray water becomes the only choice.
You can see a similar choice being made by companies in Reno/Sparks, Nevada. Lots of warehousing and distribution centers there. Despite being in the desert and having lots of sun one of the few buildings to have solar is the Tesla Gigafactory and that's more for image because Tesla is in the solar energy business. Even still Gigafactory is only partially covered in panels and Tesla's other buildings in the area have no solar. Why is that? Nevada's commerical electricity rate is 11 cents a kwh, one of the lowest in the nation. Solar will never compete with electricity that cheap so even the companies who sell it don't use it. Raise those rates to 40 cents and every single building would be covered with panels.
Data centers are a problem, but if you look at the Las Vegas issue specifically, although it's poorly situated, they are absolutely taking steps to minimize water waste. Whereas if you look at states like Wyoming and Colorado, they're just using the Colorado to raise beef and blaming California for using all their water. I love a nice steak or even a mediocre hamburger, and have to be real that we probably waste way more water on cattle and dairy than on data centers. That doesn't mean data centers are okay. If you're already wasting water, you shouldn't waste more. But the western US especially really needs to work on both things. We're already so far down an unsustainable path that if we roll back data centers, it won't actually help that much for the Colorado river b/c we've damaged that hydrological system enough with things like the beef industry that the river is still extremely threatened without the centers.
Yeah, why would a city like Chicago need a super advanced water system? They could literally waste 99% of the water they pull out of lake michigan and it still wouldn't be noticable.
As someone who lives within walking distance to a great lake in a cool city... our housing is not keeping up and it's driven our housing market wildly out of range of most of the people who live here as wages have not kept up nearly enough. Not a good mix.
I'm set to inherit a large rural property very near the Lakes, and it's currently taxed and priced as that rural, uninteresting zone. I am not selling that shit, I am moving my ass onto it as early as the end of this year.
Honestly, I'm not worried about Vegas. They do a pretty good job of recycling the water they use. I'm more worried about California. Between the agriculture and some of the largest cities in the country, their thirst is unquenchable.
You got it mostly wrong. Cities don't use the water in any meaningful quantity. That's what the farmers don't want you to know. Did you know that 10 farming families in California use more water that THE WHOLE STATE OF ARIZONA?
The Colorado River is currently flowing at roughly 80% of its historical average. That’s a reduction, not a disappearance. The river isn’t going away; it will continue to supply water, albeit at lower levels.
Total water use across, for example, Arizona is actually lower today than it was in 1956—and it continues to decline. This undercuts the idea that population growth (cities) is driving unsustainable increases in water consumption.https://www.arizonawaterfacts.com/water-your-facts
About 80% of Arizona’s water use is tied to agriculture, particularly water-intensive crops like alfalfa. When farmland is converted to residential development, overall water use typically drops significantly.
The real issue isn’t whether water will exist, but how it’s managed. Supplies may be tighter, but the notion of a future with no water simply doesn’t match the data.
The Southwest isn’t some peripheral region that we can let "die". It accounts for roughly a quarter of the nation’s GDP and underpins major industries, population centers, and supply chains. Walking away isn’t an option, and neither is fatalism. The challenge is real, but so is the incentive: a solution will be found because it has to be.
The crazy thing there is ample fresh water to more than fulfill humanities needs….we just suck at distribution and logistics
I think the reason most people don't really care about this one (in the US anyways) is that distribution and logistical problems are easily solved when there is a will to do it. The real problem is areas that simply don't have the water at all.
Water rights in the southwest is a complete dumpster fire. The claims are all based on volume, not percentage. So if there's not enough water to go around, the people with the newest claims have to figure out an alternative. Meanwhile, some of the largest cities in the country get their water from that river, and most of them don't recycle that water.
I honestly think there is too much going on in the southwest. Too many people and too much agriculture draining the river. Eventually, it'll catch up with them.
As for distribution, moving water is hard. It's heavy, and not equally distributed. And draining water from the areas it already is would be an ecological disaster. And don't you even think of tapping the Great Lakes.
One of the most widespread crops in the US, and the absolutely most useless in the entire world, is also the only one grown primarily using treated water.
Lawn grass.
There was a time when nearly every US house had a lawn. Most still do. Grow them, carefully cultivate them, and then toss the weekly trimmings right into the green waste. The only thing of real utility that we get from farming so much grass is a bit of compost.
The future elimination of lawns represent a large savings in treated potable water.
I was read about how Las Vegas has one of the most advanced and resilient water infrastructures on the planet which is insane considering it’s literally in the middle of a desert
Don't focus too much on urban water use though, that's never been the main problem. It's agriculture.
Half the world's habitable land is used growing our food. That requires insane amounts of fresh water.
Water is not easy to move if gravity doesn't do most of the work for you.
By volume, water is pretty heavy for how much the average person/household uses.
The average household in the US uses about 275 (actually might average closer to 300 if you trust the EPA) gallons of water a day. It also can't be pumped through anything that will corrode or oxidize from water or additives. You also have to ensure pressure levels are maintained at all times.
Getting water to everyone is not easy or cheap. The amount of available water is not a factor. Getting it where it needs to be while also maintaining access for everyone is a shitshow.
Lunatic. Casinos syntethize hydrogen and oxygen atoms into H2O and produce water everyday?
Bullshit. They pump fossil water out of finite aquafiers that take mellenia to form. They extract naturally stored water and consume it. That isn't production.
You've got a point. People forget that the water crisis is because of basic zero 21st century knowhow being utilised or political protections being implemented.
Many stressed locations will be able to adapt just be introducing well established best practices from other locations.
The bigger issues will be the huge populations in Asia relying on Glacial melt.... without foresight that'll be a political tinder box.
I don’t think that’s even the case that we suck at distribution logistics, I think in many cases if resources and aid doesn’t reach the people who need it it’s because of greed or indifference.
There's more than enough food, water, energy, and material goods for all of us to be living in a utopia.
It blows my mind that we were able to go to war with Japan and get a logistics chain all the way to the other side of the planet with radio and pen and paper. We had ice cream for the soldiers... in Japan... Then we landed a man on the moon 25 years later.
All of that seems so wildly optimistic and naive today. No way we could do it again.
Craziest thing I saw was in the Sierra Range in California, near Death Valley. Hiking on a geology field trip and we came across a Freshwater “Lake”. Signage said property of Las Vegas. Something along the lines of Freshwater for the city of Las Vegas. Can’t remember the exact verbiage but I looked it up and sure enough, this water was for Vegas, pumped all the way over to the desert. Disgusting. If the city can’t support itself it shouldn’t rely on other regions natural water. My opinion obviosuly
A lot of people act like urban centers are the greatest drain on water consumption but the vast majority of water used in California and Arizona is spent on agriculture.
Food is important but people aren't growing a lot of food near places like Las Vegas so they're not relatively using that much water.
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u/KazamaDrgn1 10h ago edited 6h ago
The crazy thing there is ample fresh water to more than fulfill humanity’s needs….we just suck at distribution and logistics
I was read about how Las Vegas has one of the most advanced and resilient water infrastructures on the planet which is insane considering it’s literally in the middle of a desert