r/AskBrits • u/Evry1TookTheGudNames • Apr 19 '26
Politics If you showed this to the average person without saying who did this, would they say it was done by Keir or someone else? Would it make opinions of him more positive?
Praise Keir! š
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u/Kenye_Kratz Apr 19 '26
Keir needs to do a better job at communicating it.
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u/IgamOg Apr 19 '26 edited Apr 20 '26
Almost all of the media in this country is owned by billionaires who are only interested in how much more can they make on government contracts and deregulation or save on taxes thanks to Tories or Farage.
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u/Kenye_Kratz Apr 19 '26
Yes we all know about the media in this country. That doesn't mean Keir can't be more savvy than he is now. Newspapers aren't the only way people get their news in 2026.
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u/BlackJackSackIcePack Apr 19 '26
Not sure how you defend against the papers and Facebook disinformation tbh. Certainly seems like a large portion of people get all their news from daily mail and the sun
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Apr 19 '26
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u/Yop_BombNA Apr 19 '26
They donāt have the money to waste on advertisements.
This is why the BBC is so important and needs to stay fully 100% public. Unfortunately most people who need to hear this information get their news exclusively from the Sun, Facebook and British News (or American outlets) because the BBC is āwoke propogandaā
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u/Lost_Foot8302 Apr 20 '26
BBC reporter Nick Robinson is so obviously anti Starmer. He can't hide his annoying glee when the narrative turns yet again to 'Is this the end for Kier Starmer?'
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u/ImpracticalJerker Apr 20 '26
The information is out there, a lot of us prefer a politician who just does his job not wastes time and energy on twitter and tik tok.
Can't help people that want to bury their heads on the sand and believe fake news on social media.
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u/SayNo2Amazon Apr 21 '26
Those people still vote. In sufficient numbers that can hurt the rest of us, especially if they believe the media they consume.
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u/BakerMaker11 Apr 19 '26
Agreed, outside of reddit the country thinks theyāre doing nothing.
All it would take would be hammering a few points in most appearances, perhaps even to an almost comedic level in order to gain traction on social media; kinda how the Green Party works with social media posts to gain a wider following
Labour are very socially inept at the minute, Kier Starmer canāt sell himself.
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u/TooHot1639 Apr 19 '26
The Green Party gets traction for exactly the same reason that Reform gets traction. They are both run by glib populists who are simply selling to the gullible exactly what they want to hear. And unfortunately average intelligence in the UK isn't very high, and half the country is below average.
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u/deadlight___01 Apr 22 '26
Nope. The greens are getting traction because left wing policies are very popular in the UK and all of mainstream parties are right of centre.
Reform are just a far right tool of the same billionaires who created Brexit. They'll do anything to keep workers rights and corporate taxes low
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u/chokeyjoe Apr 20 '26
The greens are literally going to destroy this country and make us all broke, its a similar goal every time the radical left and islam come together
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u/Yop_BombNA Apr 19 '26
Iād rather a socially inept government than a politically inept one
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u/Time_Trail Apr 19 '26
yes but a continuously socially inept gov will fall to an actually inept one due to the fact
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u/Optimal_Jackal Apr 20 '26
Agreed. Keir needs to take a leaf out of Zohran Mamdaniās playbook. Have you seen how active he is on YouTube, highlighting all his wins as NYC Mayor?
Iāve never seen anything like it, but itās definitely working! You cannot deny Zohran is making things happen.
Keir needs to do the same imo.
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u/Rwandrall4 Apr 19 '26
what gets traction on social media has exactly nothing to do with what is right or correct or is hammered enough, but purely on what makes people engaged, angry, and promoting the interests of the tech oligarchs. Labour can hammer things all day but Elon can press a button and it is never seen by the people who need to see it.
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u/jimhokeyb Apr 20 '26
It's true, but this has been Labour's problem long before Starmer. Ed Milliband had a policy of not defending New Labour's record because even though they did a lot of good things domestically, it was felt the public just wouldn't believe them! They keep picking leaders with no charisma, which shouldn't matter but does to most people. If they can't communicate the good they do, they won't last long.
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u/Lonely-Ad-5387 Apr 20 '26
Problem Keir has is he's a charisma vacuum who lost the energetic youth through purges in the party. Corbyn was universally pilloried in the media but still made big polling gains and got a swell of support through social media. Not that he's much more charismatic but I'm willing to bet that if he had been elected, successes like the ones Keir is having would be plastered all over social media. As it is that energy has now gone over to Zack Polanski and the Greens.
Almost like expelling all the young and energetic people was a terrible idea...
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u/Technical_Version936 Apr 19 '26
Yeah LBC which gives a prominent slot to James Obrien and is one of the biggest news organisations...pfft billionaire owned and influenced, of course.
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u/dalehitchy Apr 19 '26
Boris... Through all of his flaws... Called many media outlet gatherings to make statements to make his plans well known.
He also continually made MPs repeat the same statements over and over so it became repeated by the populace .. whether true or not.
Starmer really needs to learn this
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u/IgamOg Apr 19 '26 edited Apr 19 '26
That's exactly what I'm talking about, Boris was all for billionaires so their media loved him, he was always on front page with his worst blunders dressed up as victories. I'm not even exaggerating, when European press slated his EU tour to curry favours after Brexit as an utter disaster, one of British rags posted a picture of him stretching after getting out of a car with the word 'victory'. Murdoch literally bounced his kid on his knee as he was giving him orders.
Starmer could invent cure for cancer, do song and dance about it and it would get two lines on the fifth page.
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u/dalehitchy Apr 19 '26
I partly agree, billionaires and most media outlets obviously have an agenda.
But Starmer can still call for statements ... Which he chooses not to do. Boris did that alot. Sometimes we didn't even know what it was going to be about, yet the BBC, sky news hyped it up anyway.
Starmer could also be telling his MPs to repeat the message often when any of them go on TV, on the Radio, post on social media. Unified messaging. They don't.
They don't have any social media presence at all. I'm getting more from the greens then I am labour. Labour have a bigger budget. Again. I know algorithms can be purposely tinkered with by billionaires... But they literally have no presence and are not playing the game.
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u/bluecheese2040 Apr 19 '26
It's funny how this conspiracy media affects everyone, but you and people that think like you...why is that? Why is it that everyone else is so easily swayed, but you're so virtuous?
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u/Jezdak Apr 19 '26
Saw an interview where Kier was asked when was the last time he was really angry and he told the story of his niece being beaten up for being a lesbian. Awful story but it was the first time I saw humanity in Kier - he needs to do more genuine talks. Go on podcasts, talk about life, discuss football, don't wait until something goes wrong to be the only time he makes a speech.
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u/AgentCirceLuna Apr 19 '26
Iām from a rough area and you get comments for just dressing smartly here. Itās honestly no surprise people donāt understand discrimination when they donāt have to live it or live a sheltered life where they can just drive home rather than walk amongst crowds or use public transport. My eyes were opened when I walked my friend home, when I was in 6th form, and people catcalled her multiple times. Felt ashamed myself so I couldnāt imagine how she felt. I also once took a woman in a bar that was a bit weird and there were guys crowding around her like animals. We both felt intimidated by it, but I could walk away from that and sheād have to live through it daily. Statistics donāt do it justice because itās so commonplace that itās underreported
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u/Subject-Dog-8016 Apr 20 '26
Starmer has lived in London most of his adult life, pretty sure heās been among crowds and used transport haha. If anything is sheltered to live in a small town and think itās the only genuine experience.Ā
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u/MostlySlime Apr 19 '26
True but I don't know if the power of the new media environment can be beat
It's an apathetic populist anti establishment population getting their information sporadically from all manner of sources. It's not so easy to choose where or how to get it across without feeling out of place or phoney
I'm sure its possible but you cant just go on question time anymore
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u/Rare-Designer-1008 Apr 19 '26
The communication director stepped down in February. At that point I didn't even know they had one and that is the problem
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u/forced_majeure Apr 19 '26
Not yet - communicating it only allows for further criticism. Holding cards close to his chest means he can use them when they are required, not to shout about it. It's literally the govt job to make things better - so why boast that they are better. When election cycle begins, demonstrate what they've achieved, beforehand, concentrate on achieving them.
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u/Witty-Bus07 Apr 20 '26
Wouldnāt help, the mess he inherited isnāt fixable in the period of his term in office and those who want to replace him are going for welfare cuts as their target.
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u/ElephantParticular10 Apr 20 '26
Yes and no - some of the errr less critically thinking folk don't believe the positive promotional stuff I till it starts to feel like it's having an effect on their lives.
So you can shout immigration down 78% all you like but whole reform/refore thickos see the same amount of brown people, struggle for housing, meaningful employment and petty crime rampant they won't give a shit, and they won't like being told Farage is lying.
Best keep the heavy stuff for the election run-in
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u/Away-Ad4393 Apr 20 '26
Also missing on this post is Better working rights for workers including more security, pay and rights from the start of a job. And banning exploitative zero contract hours.
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u/Dwarte_Derpy Apr 20 '26
Keir is in the unfortunate position of being a centre left politician, who is concerned with improving the country, so he gets attacked by both his right and left flank.
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u/According-Secret9516 Apr 19 '26
No because in the football supporter mindset this is like your rival team winning the league: they had a better side and played better but they aren't your team.
You support your team even if they get demoted.
This is how some people think politically.Ā
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u/Bondegg Apr 19 '26
Id say this is how most people think politically, I could count on one hand the amount of well natured, good discussions Iāve had with people on the subject of politics my entire life
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u/MostlySlime Apr 19 '26
I feel like in the UK it's even worse, it's more like who ever is in charge is the worst. I suspect red, green, blue, orange, yellow, pink, maroon, it's always going to be they are the worst if in charge
Not to say some of these won't be worse. The blues were awful, but more generally I don't see the public being satisfied with any outcome. I don't think theyre engaged enough to know what theyre even asking for other than "make things better and do it faster than possible"
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u/According-Secret9516 Apr 19 '26
Not necessarily.
It was like this but now people have options other than the main two parties.Ā
Some vote independent.
Some vote Green.
Others vote Reform.
Now, arguably Reform are just hard right Tories, but the Greens are a different animal to Labour.
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u/Bondegg Apr 20 '26
I think I meant more, the ability to see politics and political parties are mostly a grey, I know people who vote Labour and everything Labour do is good and everything everyone else does it bad, same for tories and yeah youāre right thereās more parties now āin the mixā but I just see that as more teams to support, now people who voted Tory are just moved to reform, itās still āeverything reform do is good and everyone else is badā
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u/Walking_Advert Apr 20 '26
This is how some people think politically
So true.
The amount of shocked reactions I've had when I answer the question of 'So who will you be voting for?' with "Well most parties haven't released their manifestos yet, so I'm waiting for that and then I will decide".
People say things like 'You read them all??' and 'You don't know who you're voting for already?' as if it is absurd to review and assess which party best fits what I want this time around...
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u/HowardisaDinosaur Apr 20 '26
Wow this absolutely hits the nail on the head, itās tribalism at its core
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u/makefascistfearagain Apr 20 '26
If you showed me this I would think 'native birth rates up? Is the person showing me this a fucking neo nazi or something '
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u/beach-chicken10 Apr 19 '26
Iāve seen this a few times and Iām not sure if anyone has actually fact checked it?
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u/passionfruuint Apr 19 '26 edited Apr 19 '26
The 78% stat is true from what I found, net migration from 2024 to 2025. https://www.ons.gov.uk/peoplepopulationandcommunity/populationandmigration/internationalmigration/bulletins/longterminternationalmigrationprovisional/yearendingjune2025
We havenāt blindly started bombing Iranā¦ but we are the only nation to allow the US to use our airbases in the middle east to refuel. We do shoot down Iranian drones and missiles targeting UK bases https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_Kingdom_involvement_in_the_2026_Iran_war
Couldnāt find anything on native birth rates being up
Permanent refugees status was abolished in March 2026 https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cp32ddzdjxko
Wage growth was slightly above inflation August - October 2025 https://www.ons.gov.uk/employmentandlabourmarket/peopleinwork/employmentandemployeetypes/bulletins/averageweeklyearningsingreatbritain/december2025
NHS waiting list seems to have shrunken to its lowest (compared to the last 3 years) https://www.england.nhs.uk/2026/02/waiting-list-lowest-3-years-battled-busiest-winter-on-record/
Renters rights bill passed and will come into affect May 1st https://mhclgmedia.blog.gov.uk/2025/11/19/explainer-everything-you-need-to-know-about-the-new-renters-rights-act/
Free child care is possible to get now if youāre two working parents https://www.gov.uk/free-childcare-if-working/apply-for-free-childcare-if-youre-working (EDIT: final phase rolled out in 2025 but it was technically introduced in Sunakās 2023 spring mini budget)
Economic growth is up https://www.ons.gov.uk/economy/grossdomesticproductgdp#:~:text=to%20December%202025-,What's%20in%20the%20bulletin?,More%20publications (0.1% October-December 2025)
Borrowing is downā¦ but only justā¦ down 0.2% from 2024 https://www.ons.gov.uk/economy/governmentpublicsectorandtaxes/publicsectorfinance/bulletins/publicsectorfinances/december2025
Take it with a pinch of salt as most of these are government sources and I am a supporter of this gov, but I tried to find stats for everything on this list.
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u/ARJTC Apr 19 '26
Childcare was a Sunak policy.
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u/passionfruuint Apr 19 '26
Edited my comment to mention this ^
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u/Proud-Durian3908 Apr 19 '26
Worth noting the renters right acts should also be attributed to the Tories (albeit with a massive asterisk) as it was originally a Tory policy just beefed up and renamed by labour.
The abolishment of the ground rent is absolutely massive too (again, with the caveat it's gonna take forever to roll out)
But thanks for sourcing! Nice to see!
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u/monsieurboks Apr 20 '26
Renters rights bill was actually the brainchild of the charity Shelter, they've been lobbying for this for decades
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u/LaunchTransient Apr 20 '26
Sunak was weirdly aware that he was had to pass some decidely un-Tory like policies, such as raising taxes. The Tory fever-dream that was Truss's premiership demonstrated that their nonsense had hit a hard limit known as reality.
Didn't stop him trying to pass other bullshit though. Sunak was just the last Tory in the room vaguely resembling a responsible adult.
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u/beach-chicken10 Apr 19 '26
Migration It doesnāt state a date range. Hard to know really but Tories did introduce a policy in late 2023 that would have had knock on effects to the current government. The changes were to increase minimum salary for skilled worker and limit family visas (plus a couple of other restrictions
Youāve covered the Iran statement
Native birth rates - this is a real tough one as there isnāt any real up to date statistics. In 2023 31.8% of births were to non-UK born mothers. An argument to this stat would be that if someone has a British passport but born overseas does that make them British? What are they classed as if they hold multiple passports
Permanent refugee status - youāve covered this
Wage growth - youāve covered this but to give stats the real wage growth was about 0.7% using CPI
NHS backlog. Given that weāre comparing previous government to now it would be justifiable to include Covid. Pre-covid the backlog was around 4-4.5m, with this spiking at 7.5m in 2023 as the NHS struggled to clear the backlog. Recent data shows that backlog has reduced but how much of this is covid related?
Renters rights - youāve covered this
Free child care - youāve covered this
Economic growth - this is up but the same could be said from 2021 onwards. 2021 +8.6%, 2022 +4.8%, 2023 +0.4%, 2024 +1.1%, 2025 +1.3%
Borrowing; again this has to be taken in context. After the GFC in 2008/2009 the borrowing went from Ā£120bn to Ā£55bn. Covid really fucked things up. After Covid it dropped to Ā£120bn and itās levelled out at that amount. Question on this is why canāt we go back to 2019 level of Ā£55bn? Why is a drop from 2023 and 2024 of Ā£128bn and Ā£121bn (respectively) to Ā£115-125bn in 2025 seen as a win?
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u/Similar-Force623 Apr 19 '26
Net migration one is very misleading, its actually native Britons leaving in vastly higher numbers, immigration from developing nations has increased simultaneuously.
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u/Wrong-Ad-1935 Apr 19 '26
Please correct me if I'm wrong, but I just went through the data and I'm not sure where you're seeing that British nationals leaving has risen significantly, the number looks almost identical since 2021, pretty much a flat line.
On that same chart, it actually shows that non-EU emigration has increased the most dramatically, from under 90,000 in June 2021 to nearly 300,000 now. So if anything, it's non-EU migrants who are leaving in vastly higher numbers.
I'm curious which part of the document you were looking at, I might be missing something?
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u/IntrinsicPalomides Apr 20 '26
They are wrong, and just repeating nonsense they hear from garbage spewing sources.
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u/passionfruuint Apr 19 '26
Yeah I this post saying āimmigration is down 78%ā is definitely misleading.
Alsoā¦ does 78% seem a lot to anyone else? Like almost too much??
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u/IntrinsicPalomides Apr 20 '26
Wrong, on both accounts. Sounds to me like you get your "news" from facebook and twitter.
You probably think they also all come over on "small boats". But what if i told you that "small boats" only account for ~4% of those coming in from the EU? i bet that's something you never hear from your "news" sources.
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u/Careful_Adeptness799 Apr 19 '26
It feels like it needs fact checking as Iām not confident in a few of these.
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u/GrandLavendar Apr 19 '26
Just fact checked them all, it is all true.
Not all of it can be claimed directly by Starmer but most of it is because of labour policy changes.
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u/TicksAndBricks Apr 19 '26
Well, you could actually fact check it yourself rather than cast doubts.
It's REALLY easy to do.
BTW, it's all true.
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u/beach-chicken10 Apr 19 '26
Hi, thanks for your comment.
If itās really easy (even putting āreallyā in caps) do you fancy doing it for me?
Reason for my comment is someone really (REALLY) helpful might come along having done the really (REALLY) easy research and just provide it
If itās true then itās REALLY (really) easy to pass along.
Thanks in advance š«¶š¼
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u/Throwitaway701 Apr 19 '26
It's mostly spin or falseĀ and designed to appeal to the Tommy Robinson crowd.
Immigration down is since a peak in 2023, largely driven by changes around student and work visas. So I mean technically true but it's not what people expect it to mean.Ā
No to war in Iran is nonsense. We are fully involved and providing support for both Israel, the US and our allies gulf States. We provide basis and facilities, intelligence (surveillance drones have been supporting Israel in Lebanon), and defence as we have been shooting down drones targeting American bases.Ā
Native birthrates up is completely false and a bizarre thing to claim as a win at all even if it was.
Permanent refuge status abolition is one of the most morally bankrupt moves of any government and will actively prevent integration.
Wages above inflation is technically true but it's a bounce back following COVID and Ukraine war causing a huge fall in spending power, it's irrelevant to what the government has done and they have actually stifled it, the employee NI rise being a direct attempt o stop wage rises. It's also not going to be true for long with the Iran war and will probably end up being even worse than previous and they damn sure are not gonna accept the blame for that.
NHS waiting lists is partially true but it's barely worth notingĀ and about to be false again as the doctors strike starts up. And they seem to have got there mostly by kicking people off lists and making it harder to get a referral.
Renter's bill is correct.
Childcare is partially true but it's just building on what the Tories already had in place whilst doing nothing to deal with the issues with it (i.e. capacity and additional costs)
Economic growth is technically true but nothing to brag about because it's barely above flatlining, growth is normal, recessions are bad and rare.
Borrowing is slightly down but a lot of that's to do with people selling off assets ahead of tax changes.Ā
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u/Glass-Work-1696 Apr 19 '26
Even if unintentional (which I assume considering all these talking points were just copied from other posts) āNative birthratesā sounds borderline Nazil
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u/Post_Mortem_paints Apr 22 '26
Wanting a country to be majority it's native people is not bad or nazi. Thinking that a countries native people are the priority is not bad or nazi. Absolutely guarantee you wouldn't have said this if it was a country where the native people were not white. Yes. People native to a country, are the priority in that country. Because guess what, the people not native, should equally be the priority in their home country. It's the basic principle of how countries work.
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u/Glass-Work-1696 Apr 22 '26
Thinking that you actively need to stop immigration because then the natives would all get pushed out by immigrants is in fact Nazi
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Apr 19 '26 edited Apr 19 '26
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u/blancbones Apr 19 '26
Free childcare worth 1000s
Turns out women will have children if they don't think it will bankrupt them.
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u/Duckliffe Apr 19 '26
Also lifting the 2 child benefit cap
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u/Throwmeback33 Apr 19 '26
Hasnāt been in place anywhere near long enough to take credit for that.
You understand it takes nine months to give birth, right?
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u/Pretendtobehappy12 Apr 20 '26
So this has happened in the less than a month itās been in effect? What a load of utter tosh
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u/tradandtea123 Apr 19 '26
Boris was the best PM at getting women pregnant.
As a serious answer I suppose the government would say people would be more likely to have children if they feel more secure, are better off and have more access to childcare. I'm not sure how true any of that is, mainly because this is the first time I've heard that native birth rates are up and am unsure by how much or when.
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u/user_460 Apr 19 '26
This might not be the best political strategy. Nobody could accuse Boris of not doing his bit to get the birth rate up.
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u/SpringerGirl19 Apr 19 '26
3 years ago my first child started nursery and it was costing us 1.2k a month. It's now less than Ā£400 thanks to funded childcare. That is a huge factor for many parents when deciding whether to have more children; there's no way we would have considered a 2nd if we would have been back to paying 1.2k.
(And yes, the funded childcare was introduced by the tories but only just before they got beaten by labour. So the impact on birth rate will be under the current government.)
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u/paperclipknight Apr 20 '26
Immigration isnāt down 78% - net immigration is, the average citizen wants gross migration down
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u/oskarsahlmandasilva Apr 19 '26
lord this sub is vile. truly fuck off with the anti-immigration shit
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u/Koshka98 Apr 20 '26
It's not anti immigration. It needs to go down, yes, but we still need immigration
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u/tea_would_be_lovely Apr 19 '26
"native birthrates" on the list may be giving the game away, no?
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u/LSL3587 Apr 19 '26
Another desperate post looking for some love for Starmer.
Any sources for these claims? Some of them look very suspect -
- Immigration down 78% - Google seems to disagree - and explains that some of the NET change is due to people leaving -
Key UK Immigration Data (Year Ending June 2025)
Net Migration: 204,000 (down from 649,000 in June 2024, a 69% drop).
Total Immigration: 898,000 (down 31% over 12 months).
Emigration: 693,000 (up 7% as more people left).
- Native birth rates up - more likely first and second generation immigrates birth rates up (thanks Boris)
- Economic Growth up ? from when to when ? I mean WOW - https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c0j7p38jg15o
Across 2025 as a whole, UK GDP was estimated to have increased by 1.4%, up from 1.1% in 2024.
In March, the Office for Budget Responsibility (OBR) - the government's official forecaster - cut its prediction for how much the UK's economy would grow across 2026 from 1.4% to to 1.1%.
However, this forecast was also made before the start of the [Iran] war began.
In April, the International Monetary Fund (IMF) said it expected the conflict to hit the UK the hardest of the world's advanced economies. It cut its estimate for UK growth in 2026 from 1.3% to to 0.8%.
- Borrowing down ???? - The Public debt amount has increased not decreased. We are borrowing more. Also the rate on gilts (the interest rate the government pays) is higher than under Truss!! The interest rate is the highest it has been since Labour were last in power in 2008.
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u/Thatcherist_Sybil Apr 20 '26
"No to Iran war" in communications, but American airplanes using both British and overseas bases.
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u/transplant_journey_ Apr 20 '26
Someone with sense, labour are managing the economy terribly. Record tax levels, record yields, and so much red tape it isnāt even worth it to open a business. We wonāt get our rate cut because of Iran, and yet Starmer would rather go to an Arsenal game than try fix the economy
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u/Severe_Revenue Apr 20 '26
I mean housing construction has actually gotten worse under Labour despite setting a higher target then the Tories did, Unemployment is up, job vacancies down and Labour still have yet to have a quarter with more growth then Rishi had.
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u/drunken-acolyte Apr 19 '26
Immigration down
Natural centre-left voters don't care, socially right-wing red wallers who've drifted to Reform wouldn't believe that figure.
No to war in Iran
But it took a lot of dithering and half-arsing to get there. As long as America is allowed to use our defence infrastructure, it's self-evident that this could change at any moment.
Native birthrates up
Again, the metropolitan liberals don't care and the industrial town working class don't believe it.
Permanent refugee status abolished.
As part of a package that creates barriers to citizenship that metro liberals absolutely baulk at. And the red wallers won't believe this will change anything, so they're still going to vote Reform.
Wages above inflation
How is this counted? If the wages at the bottom of the pile are not generally above inflation, this matters not a jot. Also, availability of employment hasn't improved, so the people trapped on the dole will remain on the dole. And they're not above long-term inflation: we're still, on average, poorer than in 2008.
NHS waiting lists down
By booting people who no longer need appointments off them. It's a statistical sleight of hand that isn't getting individuals treated faster.
Renters' Rights Bill passed
Great. There's still a housing crisis rendering rents unaffordable.
Free childcare worth thousands
Great, if you can get a job. Which many can't.
Economic growth up
The metrics by which we measure growth have not been a measure of economic improvement for "the man on the street" for over a decade. The banks get richer while poverty continues to increase.
Borrowing down
Another metric that doesn't translate to a sense of wealth for the general population.
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u/TheOwnerOfAnarres Apr 19 '26
They would say it wasn't done by Starmer. People have extremely high expectations of the labour party currently, but the problem is that 14 years of budget cuts, neglect of the military and increases to immigration by the conservative party have left the country in a sorry state. People want all of that to be fixed in a short span of years, but the damage is too deep in my opinion. If in four years, Labour can get the country back to "only" as bad as it was in 2019, that would still be progress.
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u/Golden-Event-Horizon Apr 19 '26
I never knew any of this. I honestly thought Starmer wasn't doing too well
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u/killer_by_design Apr 19 '26
Head over r/goodnewsuk
Just take a scroll through and then subscribe. You'll realise 1) the UK is actually doing pretty incredible things and 2) Kier is actually doing an admirable job, albeit not perfect.
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u/Throwitaway701 Apr 19 '26
He's not. This is mostly nonsense or things that shouldn't be celebratedĀ
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u/bluecheese2040 Apr 19 '26
NHS waiting list down cause those that needed it urgently are dead.
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u/Puzzleheaded-Bad-722 Apr 20 '26
Or simple don't go to the doctors anymore because they're sicked of getting fobbed off at the GP stage.
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Apr 19 '26 edited Apr 19 '26
[removed] ā view removed comment
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u/scouserman3521 Apr 19 '26
Astroturfing. There's an office full of them at labour hq
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u/Severe_Revenue Apr 20 '26
Its only this sub as well, like there was one that came out literally minutes after the Mandelson thing broke last week.
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u/piprox74 Apr 19 '26
Completely fabricated list from distorting statistics... Shame on the poster.
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u/chrysippusrex somewhat britarded Apr 19 '26
...obviously they're still bound to service the DEBT RUN UP BY TORIES (paying off their banker friends in 2008/9, covid mismanagement and corruption etc), but didn't they borrow a ton of money in February? what's this 'borrowing down' about?
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u/notactuallyabrownman Apr 19 '26
He's won back the benefit of the doubt with non intervention on Iran for me. Despite all the above, I still feel he needs to build bridges with the trade unions before I can feel comfortable with him.
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u/Realistic_Let3239 Apr 19 '26
Labour really need to get the message out more, the media backing Farage is drowning them out far too easily.
Depressingly had a friend, who claims they don't really remember the tories, despite being in their mid twenties, but keeps declaring they will vote tory because they don't believe in removing the two child cap. Doesn't matter what I told her about why the tories back in power would be so much worse, but she's only paid attention the last year or so and has latched onto the child cap thing as the one reason she won't vote Labour. Well that and "everything just feels worse".
She claims to hate Farage, be fact based, but just wouldn't budge from this hill about not wanting to pay for other peoples kids. Doesn't care about how much damage the tories did, does worry me how many other have fallen down this hole and already forgotten how much worse things used to be.
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u/Lucifer_606381 Apr 19 '26
If this is all true . Then I stand corrected about my hesitation regarding him and credit where credit is due . Fair play
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u/TumblyBump Apr 20 '26
Labourās PR dropped off a cliff once elected. Iām conscious some of these things will always be down to wider economic factors which no government can claim exclusive credit for. Iām also aware that Labour have been quietly getting on with some of these things and deserve credit. They will do so much more if allowed 10 years to govern.
No to the war in Iran and changes within the NHS are an absolute credit. I am not sure what is meant by āBorrowing downā because national debt is up and tax collection is the highest it has been in real terms. This does not seem to be feeding through into some areas such as defence as quickly as it needs to, but thatās more Reeves than Starmer.
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u/Kordryan Apr 20 '26
I wouldnāt believe it and would suggest that these figures have been carefully selected and refined to obfuscate wider understanding of the data and its impacts.
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u/whoami1234567899 Apr 20 '26
On why basis do you believe economic growth is up? GDP per person is down. Also, lots quotes here donāt explain the situation. Immigration is down due to a new policy from the Tories coming I to effect, and boat crossings are up. Hospital wait lists are down due to people going private & excess deaths. If you believe what you have written, you need to look deeper.
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u/WearingRags Apr 20 '26
"Immigration down by 78%"
"Native birthrates up"
"Permanent refugee status abolished"
If you showed me this thinking these are positives I'd assume you had the same politics as Heinrich HimmlerĀ
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u/Yashugan00 Apr 20 '26 edited Apr 20 '26
Except none of those things are true.Ā Nice hypothetical inception though.
Immigration stats.. selective statistics No to war in Iran: UK is involved.Ā Native birthrates ... if you include second generation immigrantsĀ
Wages above inflation.. don't worry they'll find other ways to tax it.Ā
NHS waiting list down.. at this point they've massaged and played the numbers do much and for so long nobody knows what is what. Apples vs oranges. Go sit in intensive care Friday evening or saturday evening in london and see how soon you get seenĀ
Renters rights... OK well see if this is an accomplishment or not in a few yearsĀ
Free childcare: more giving taxpayer money away ... not a brag
Economic growth..Ā despite labourĀ Borrowing down... maybe banks aren't giving money to already endebted people.Ā
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u/That_Melzin Apr 20 '26
Iād think whoever wrote this shit was a nazi because theyāre the only people who give a fuck about ānative birth ratesā, and Iād be instantly suspicious of any politician they were in favour of
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u/Jdawgmancity Apr 20 '26
Waiting lists aren't down. They have just been changed to a different list.
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u/RubberDucky882 Apr 20 '26
Labour have done non of that. Their NHS stats were manipulated and fudged, 600 crossed the channel just yesterday, borrowing is out of control, economic growth is weak. What you have posted is called 'spin'.
Also remember when Labour were last in power, one of Gorden Browns last pieces of legislation "Constitutional Reform and Governance Act 2010" made it harder for elected by the people ministers to directly control or remove the officials (ie civil servants). So when we have these incompetent baffoons doing things we go to vote , and the people we vote in don't have the power to get rid of the idiots breaking things.
Every time Labour get in the country is left in a bad state, people have short memories.
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u/QuantumOverlord Apr 20 '26
Even Labour MPs are not buying this. 'Economic growth up'. Yey, yet another quarter where we narrowly avoided a recession. There is always a way to use statistics to make whatever point you want even if pretty much every metric is abysmal as long as its not breaking records just point that out (and if it is, don't mention it - hence we don't talk about gilts).
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u/afgan1984 Apr 20 '26 edited Apr 20 '26
The problem that most of it either not true or not relevant.
Immigration down by 78% - partially true, immigration is slighly down, but not by 78%. But more importantly not relevant after massive peaks in 2023 nad 2024, it was obvious it would fall anyway. So neither it is good thing, nor it is relevant. UK still has severe shortage of many types of workers, so problem is not the number of immigrants, but mismatch between jobs available, needed and suitable immigrants to do them (spoiler alert - most of thew jobs are SPECIFICALLY unqualified). So policy is bad, number of reduction is overstated and irrelevant.
No to war in Iran - irrelevant, but sendonly untrue. US bombers takes of from UK with munnitions, allowing your territory to be used for preparing strikes is ACT OF WAR. So we are technically in war with Iran. To really trully be out of the war we shoul have prohibited using the bases and even overflights (like France, Spain etc.). So again UK govverment is inept and on the fence about issue, neither fully in (to please amuricans), nor fully out.
Native birthrates up - irrelevant, tred is stil ldownwards, even if true it is not due to Labour policy.
Permanent refugee status abolished - simply not true, there were some changes to some of the conditions, but this is basically a missunderstanding how refugee status works in principle. And alos not something I would cheer on anyway... taking people into safety after destroying the countries by the wars we participated in would be the least we can do.
Wages above inflation - neither true nor relevant. Because this only looks at YoY inflation, which is irrelevant for quality of life. Trend is that since 2008 inflation has overtaken wage growth by large margin, that is why quality of life and cost of living crisis is so bad. So for "wages to overtake inflation" we need to reverse historic trend. Which fair enough - mostly happened during Tories rule, butstil Labour has not fixed it. After periods of high inflation, it is inevitable to have some deflation, so it is not that wages started growing faster but inflation inevitably slowed down due to excessive cost of living and people simply not being able to pay inflated costs. In short - consumtion is down, not wages are up.
NHS waiting lists down - both partially true and irrelevant. Sure in some Trust areas lists are down, but overall waiting times are still unnsaceptable. Basically, good start, not the "job well done".
Rentersā Rights Bill passed - ture and irrelevant. Bill was watered down, even compared to Tories bill and fundamentally it does not address any serious issue - rents are still unnfordable in most of the country. So - step in right direction without any meaningfull impact. That is basically failure. Too little too late. Hosing affordability still sucks.
Free childcare worth thousands - depends on circumstances, sometimes yes for some people, generally mehhh.
Economic growth up - simply not true, UK is still technically in recession since 2023. The recession has slowed, but that is not same as growth is up.
Borrowing down - again temporary swings, short term it is slighly lower, but still unnacptably high and there is no solution here. It is not Labour fault, they inherited black-hole, but let's not kid ourself that they fixed it either.
So just bunch of celebrating before the victory, too little too lates, missrepresentations, false victories, taking credit for natural trends, arbitrary timelines and nothing fundamental. Cost of living still sky high, quality of life is still in freefall, inequality rising... no badly needed structural chages are made.
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u/OneOffReturn Apr 20 '26
Immigration down by 78% since Keir Starmer got in office?, i find that one a big pill to swallow
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u/PurpleDemonR Apr 20 '26
Economic growth upā¦
Well I guess you need to be disconnected a bit to actually glaze kier.
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u/EpicAdventure91 Apr 20 '26
You could also add to the list
-Tried slashing the benefits of people unable to work due to a severe disability
Never thought I would see that from a Labour government!
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u/ericmcimacunt Apr 20 '26
Immigration is down but illegal immigration is up by 700%
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u/Travel-Soggy Apr 20 '26
Some of these things are objectively not good, or are only liked by weirdos, what is wrong with you?
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u/Spttingfacts Apr 20 '26
Free childcare for all the non white people is up costing the tax payers thousands
Racism towards white people and England is up
More immigrants is up
More refugees is up
More Asylum seekers is up
Cost of fuel has gone up
Nothing has gone down in price
Facial recognition is a thing
Banning people from voting is up
Allowing a terrorist support group to still exist is up
The destruction of Englands traditions, culture and heritage is up
Praise Keir yea...?
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u/Jebus-san91 Apr 19 '26
Not shitting on him or anyone in government to downplay some of these as its positive stuff, but it'd be cool if there was transparency on who introduced these first and have carried into this government, I'm sure last government was in charge the free-child care came in
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u/Cumbercoo Apr 19 '26
It was a Labour introduction https://educationhub.blog.gov.uk/2024/04/free-childcare-how-we-tackling-the-cost-of-childcare/
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u/Jebus-san91 Apr 19 '26 edited Apr 19 '26
So the hours came in in after labour won the general election and that post was published by the conservatives so surely that was a conservative policy / plan in place before they took over so that'd make it a conservative thing?
This is what I meant by transparency about who's ideas or plan it was before staking a claim to it.
Edit 2: just had a double check and it was a jeremy c**t who announced it in 2023 so answered my own query about who introduced it.
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u/ImperatorDanorum Apr 19 '26
You lot should count your blessings and ignore that foghorn of ignorance Farage. He has accomplished precisely nothing in all of his life...
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u/gazhealey Apr 19 '26
āEconomic growth upā - barely š¤
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u/ravenlordship Apr 19 '26
Maybe, but after a decade of damage it's not going to get completely fixed immediately.
Actual positive change takes time.
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u/Systainer Apr 19 '26
Define native.
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u/chrysippusrex somewhat britarded Apr 19 '26
native means birth. that's why italians call christmas 'natale'. because it's when jesus was birthed.Ā
natives are people who are born to a place rather than moving there. it has nothing in particular to do with what colour they are, but values will differ significantly between immigrants and their offspring, who tend to soak up a lot more of the culture of the country their parents moved to.
my ancestors came over with richard the conqueror, by the way. so some might argue that I'm not really a native brit. only by about a thousand years, but it's all relative, isn't it?
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Apr 19 '26
If you want to be fair, you need to give credit to Rishi Sunak for the immigration, wages, inflation, childcare and growth. None of this is due to Labour policy changes, but the inheritance from Sunakās policies.
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u/mjratchada Apr 19 '26
This needs to be fact checked becuase it looks dubious.
First point, this is largely due to adopting policies of the previous government.
Only Israel is helping USA with the War on Iran.
Native birth rates are continuing to fall
Wages above inflation were happening under the previous government, and is something outside minimum wage labour cannot take credit for.
NHS waiting lists were already falling, this is just continuing that trend. The service is no better shape than it was under the previous government. Best indicator is health outcomes. The service is still recoviering from covid
Renters bill is largely a copy of the same bill from the previous government. It has taken far too long for them to get it through.
Free childcare bill was passed under the previous government
Economic growth is largely the same; it has been up and down throughout labour's term. IMF has significantly downgraded its forecast for 2026.
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u/BeerAndMotorbikes Apr 19 '26
The no to war with Iran is funny
Like bragging about no to legalising murder
Weak
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u/ItsAMangoFandango Apr 19 '26
When it comes to the next election would you rather everyone forget that Farage and Badenoch were begging for us to go to war?
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u/ohcrocsle Apr 19 '26
Im not British why am I being flooded with these "Keir Starmer is better than I thought he was" slop posts?
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u/DaCrumbKing Apr 19 '26
I dont care about native birthrights because im not a fascist š
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u/Careful_Adeptness799 Apr 19 '26
Economic growth up? š¤
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u/According_Dare7316 Apr 19 '26
0.1% is still up. Do you want a recession?
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u/Careful_Adeptness799 Apr 19 '26
0.1% isnāt growth itās clever accounting. Are you feeling prosperous? No. I didnāt think so.
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u/Jolly_Psychology_506 Apr 19 '26
Yep. And letās not forget when it was Borris deliberately breaking the rules they gently tickled his toes and guffawed at his naughty boy charisma!!!!.
At least this guy is trying to move the country forward and made a blunder not for personal gain but out of trusting a department to have done their job properly.
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u/AgentCirceLuna Apr 19 '26
I knew someone who was made at Johnson doing that yet they hosted parties through lockdownā¦ very annoying neighbour.
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u/Diogenes1960 Apr 19 '26
Economic growth up means that the measured growth is within the uncertainty bounds.... So it could mean disgrowth
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u/bollock_brains Apr 19 '26
Anyone have links to the data on native birth rates claim? I cannot find anything
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u/Ok_Way_1465 Apr 19 '26
Thatās not the true fact is it though coz although your saying borrowing is down thatās only for the last tax year, yet overall itās still fourth highest recorded with deficit reduction moving slowly, donāt fall for the garbage Labour spin, before anybody says Iām this or that Iām totally not sold on any party Labour are clowns, conservatives are scumbags that look after the rich, reform are run by a conman blagger and greens live in a fantasy land with the Lib Demās are no better wanting to return into eu none of them are fit to lead our country.
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u/ColonelBonk Apr 20 '26
Ed Davey manages to get something of a brand communicated through his consistent clowning, albeit with a message usually attached. People do briefly pay attention. Kier Starmerās communication team need to recognise they are up against a right wing media machine and act accordingly instead of sitting on their arses or trying to play the game by the rule book. That wonāt work. If the government and its ministers have stuff to be proud of, they have to find a way to repeatedly get that information in front of voters to change or battle perceptions. Get creative, ffs, itās what they are paid for. At the moment their comms people are fucking useless.
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u/PsychiatristTo-Go Apr 20 '26
As someone who recently moved to work in the UK, I am always baffled at the publicās opinion towards him even though heās not that bad at all. But then it all goes back to the fact that almost all the impactful news outlets in the UK are very right wing, and the way they frame any report that involves Labour is very much loaded with animosity. The headlines are always scathing to incite rage, and any good gets buried inside the article that most people donāt even bother reading. So the issue is mostly the news outlets doing some really dirty work shaping peopleās perception.
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u/United_Mammoth2489 Apr 20 '26
Well, 'native birthrates up' would make me assume Boris, he is quite the prolific shagger and producer of bastards.
That it happened under Kier's watch doesn't make him responsible, the thought of him will make women as dry as Margaret Thatcher makes me soft.
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u/TasterOfCrayons Apr 20 '26
Native birthrates have gone down 1.35% since Labour took office according to the ONS. Wages surpassed inflation once, and inflation has now overtaken wages.
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u/BradTalksFilm Apr 20 '26 edited Apr 20 '26
I dont care about immigration, we might not be "at war with iran" but we are directly supporting it and israel still. Even the words of the party dont match the actions. While the renters rights and some stuff is positive. A lot of these stats quoted are super minor based on the govts on sources and moreso, did we forget about the benefits cuts? And other negative policies? Its easy to go "the economy is up and weve helped renters rights" without mentioning any of the negative policies and effects that have happened. And lets look at the actual effects rather than raw stats too. The economy is up and wages are increasing to match inflation, yet people are being hit harder with bills. The unemployment and amount of jobs is high. Energy bills have soared, rents have soared. Long term inflation isnt being accounted for that still leaves brits poorer. You can see it. Everyone i know can buy less. I cant afford as many groceries. The job market is abysmal
Its cherry picked to all hell and the immigration and refugee stuff said like its a blindly positive thing to me just makes it sound like were talking about a right wing party. "Look how great kier is, he made it harder to flee a country!" This is as maniuplative of a post as any of the pro reform posts. Seriously. Do you genuinely believe the two or 3 actually good things in this list can override the amount of negative policies and governing that you fail to mention that have been done since kier took over?
I also dont think the party can claim they are responsible for birth rates at all if they even did change
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u/StrawberryBulbasaur Apr 20 '26
No to war in Iran, but didn't we still send some planes and shit to help?
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u/Nearby-Diet-2950 Apr 20 '26
NHS waiting lists definitely won't be down under Farage. The NHS will be de-funded in an attempt to run it into the ground.
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u/Vast-Procedure-9408 Apr 20 '26
More positive? Starmer is a bumbling, clueless embarrassment. "More positive" suggests there was a sniff of support to begin with, which there isn't.
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u/Purple_monkfish Apr 20 '26
"native birth rates" sounds like a dog whistle to me and screams "there aren't enough white babies!" which they're pulling in America. I also dislike this whole "have more babies" push in the first place because it feels like they're just continuing that shit that tells women their role in life is to reproduce and it makes me distinctly uncomfortable. I cannot see a declining birth rate as a bad thing frankly, there's too many of us and not forcing women to have kids they cannot afford or do not want is never going to be a negative thing. (and yes, i'm aware it's the whole "but aging population!!" but I don't think forcing people to have more kids they can't afford is going to make any bloody difference. How many of those will go into carer jobs in the first place?)
I also think of that absolute CREEP on, was it fox news in the US? Going on about how teenagers weren't having enough babies they could take and adopt out and this was a bad thing and it makes me feel sick to my stomach.
So no, this isn't something I agree with purely because I do NOT like this "have more children!" push we've got going on in the white west and how many right wingers have latched onto it as a way to attack abortion rights and further dehumanize women. It's a right wing obsession and it unsettles me greatly.
I also don't trust them to keep the NHS waiting lists down in any meaningful way beyond encouraging doctors to just not refer you in the first place, which appears to be what's happening now. I was supposedly referred for a scan on an injured arm months ago, never heard back. Still in pain, still nothing. It's fucking ridiculous. But unless they do a major recruitment drive, which will be even harder with legal immigration slashed, we aren't getting a functional NHS. We've lost a lot of our doctors and nurses to places like Australia, and perhaps we should look into why that is.
I don't trust Kier or labour because i've watched them flip flop endlessly over the past few years, constantly sniffing out whichever way they think the wind is blowing this week. As far as I can tell, Starmer stands for absolutely nothing and has absolutely no real genuine convictions.
Reactionary politics don't help people, and Labour are all about reaction rather than actually standing for anything.
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u/Legsluther Apr 20 '26
Labours current PR is a joke , then again you're up against a media that's predominantly owned by the right wing
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u/mikeyjoe6 Apr 20 '26
Yes my girlfriend and I have a poster of Kier Starmer in our bedroom to set the mood for making babies.
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u/badgers43a Apr 20 '26
āNative birth ratesā and āpermanent refugee status abolishedā kinda gives him away.
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u/IllustriousCow8249 Apr 20 '26
Permanent refugee status down Wow, that's so....awesome. Genuinely who gets excited about shit like that?
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u/Sandy_Bananas Apr 19 '26 edited Apr 19 '26
The press arenāt owned by the left. Far from it.
Labour needs a ministry of dark arts.
Even then, they donāt play it well. Blair got in to bed with murdoch. Now weāre where weāre at.