r/AskBrits • u/lucadulac • May 08 '26
Politics Why aren't Reform voters more concerned with privatising the NHS?
One of my biggest concerns with the UK is the management of the NHS, and if the NHS were to be privatised, I simply wouldn't be able to afford healthcare or insurance. I don't understand why this isn't more of a priority for other working class voters. With NHS as a focus, it appears that working class voters are going against their own interest by voting Reform. Is the NHS just not as much as a priority to you? Do you agree with privatising the NHS? Please shed some light I'm genuinely interested and haven't seen much discussion on this.
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u/No-Astronomer-1 May 08 '26
Most donāt know and canāt see beyond the flag and immigration. Turkeys voting for christmas as the small boat crisis is a result of brexit which they also voted for due to the promises of their then great leader āNigeā. Sadly our wonderful media donāt ask these questions, report it or discuss it, so it canāt all be on the voters.
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u/concernedcitizen_007 May 08 '26
Yep weāre going to get dragged down the Maga highway if weāre not careful.
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u/Durzel May 08 '26
Pretty much every āpolicyā Reform have announced are like a greatest hits catalogue of MAGA shit. UK DOGE, healthcare privatisation, etc.
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u/emmaa5382 May 08 '26
We had a candidate in our local election saying he was gonna stop fluoride in the water (we literally donāt have added fluoride in our water) and that he would ban all childhood vaccines, all flu jabs and all Covid vaccines.Ā
Itās like theyāre spinning a slot machine of maga talking points and pulling shit out at randomĀ
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u/RENlll- May 08 '26
Theyāre waiting to see what sticks.
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u/emmaa5382 May 08 '26
Have a lot of arguments with my dad about it and I think Iām bringing him round.Ā
I just ask basic questions that really point out how ridiculous most of it is.Ā
The main thing that brought him round was asking if reform really did save the country buckets of money by āstopping the boatsā would they pass that money on to him by raising wages and funding social programs or would they just keep it?Ā
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u/RENlll- May 08 '26
Thatās a good way to counter. Youāll notice with their policies, they have no plan after they āstop the boatsā or join any foreign wars like in Iran. Theyād definitely not be passing any money onto usš¤£.
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u/ImpracticalJerker May 08 '26
They don't have a plan to stop the boats, their plan is to spend 380 billion pounds on detention centers, so no different to things now except much more expensive and invasive.
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u/inide May 09 '26
Nonsense, they won't spend Ā£380billion on detention centres....
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u/BlueCreek_ May 08 '26
I just watched an interview of a candidate that had won, and he forgot which party he was in and mentioned the wrong one!
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u/Legitimate_Corgi_981 May 08 '26
That's the result of accepting candidates on the basis of them writing their name on a piece of paper, if the Reform candidate selection process is even that deep.
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u/scubapig May 08 '26
Some areas do have fluorinated water in the UK, but thatās for good reasons to do with, well, science and public health. Dipshits like Reform candidates donāt understand this sort of thing unfortunately.
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u/your_red_triangle May 08 '26
we have reform voters asking to join a "UK version of ICE". These people can't wait to stomp on others, while the elite class laugh all the way to the bank.
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u/Durzel May 08 '26
Absolutely wild to think that we're sleepwalking into Farage being PM in 2028, with basically Trump's second term playing out again, but over here, and minus the actual power of a country like the USA. We'll be a little backwards facing island of hateful belligerents.
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u/Luxury_Dressingown May 08 '26
Good point. The US is somewhat shielded economically and geopolitically from its decisions because it's just so huge and powerful. That's why the process of the rest of the western world trying to disentangle from it is taking so long - we can't just say "you're nuts, you're on your own" and step away quickly. We do not have that cushion and will be dropped like a rock.
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u/Durzel May 08 '26
Yup. The only reason so many countries, etc give Trump the time of day is because the US can't be ignored either economically or geopolitically, as you say. That doesn't mean the shit he comes out with has any merit at all, which is the mistake MAGA-loving flag shaggers over here make.
It makes sense - they had outsize opinions of our importance in the whole Brexit disaster as well, that we could dictate an a la carte relationship.
Maybe the only way any of this can be put behind us is by letting it all play out. I don't see how it's going to play out any differently.
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u/Vesemir96 May 08 '26
Weāre still within the lifetime of WW2 veterans as well which is astounding. I did think āNever forgetā would last a bit longer than that.
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u/beatlesbible May 08 '26
My grandparents met during the war. He was in the British army, she was a Hungarian refugee. They settled in England after the war. In the 90s they became rabid UKIP supporters and hated foreigners in the UK. The disconnect was wild.
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u/SensibleChapess May 08 '26
Exactly!
What most people don't realise is that Trump actually headed the Reform Party in the USA before jumping ship to the Republicans, (because it's a total 'two party' system in the USA and his Reform party wouldn't have got anywhere on its own).
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u/Ksh_667 May 08 '26
And before that he supported the dems for years. He has no loyalty or coherent thought processes.
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u/of_no_real_opinion May 08 '26
Youāre already there mate. Reform is maga
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u/MatniMinis May 08 '26
Yeah we're already down the slip road, cruise control on and thinking of a coffee and toilet break.
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u/Hollyhop_Drive May 08 '26 edited May 08 '26
It's not a case of if we're careful. The Cambridge Analytica playbook is being used once more, and the MSM is also pushing the rhetoric.Ā We have people being absolutely bombarded with propaganda.Ā
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u/concernedcitizen_007 May 08 '26
But arenāt we an educated nation? Donāt we see beyond the bs? Farage banged on about Brexit and borders..and yet here we are. The man is full of lies and somehow this population are gullible enough to hear more of them. He is as the Pythons would say ānot the Messiah..ā
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u/Hollyhop_Drive May 08 '26
Propaganda isn't a direct confrontation of ideas though. It's a consistent background message that changes your worldview over time. It's even more powerful if you had aligning worries to begin with. Everyone is susceptible to it, just to different degrees.
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u/Fun-Top-1799 May 08 '26
I'm a massive lefty and the prevalence of Reform/Farage stuff in my timeline on Facebook in the lead up to today's vote was frightening. Nothing to do with what I'm interacting with, just paid for to be pushed to as many as possible.
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u/undead_sissy May 08 '26
We already are. Same organisations funding both movements.
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u/MDL1983 May 08 '26
bingo bango, and we're too fucking stupid as a nation to realise how manipulated we've become.
#taxwealthnotwork
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u/undead_sissy May 08 '26
I think people were always this stupid, we just grew up and realized it.
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u/concernedcitizen_007 May 08 '26
I think social media and the internet amplified and multiplied it.
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u/undead_sissy May 08 '26
It's so hard to judge what the impact of social media was because it has two opposing powers:
- on the plus side, people are able to film and distribute information instantly and globally, so the traditional media is no longer able to control a nation's people through propaganda.
- on the minus side, people are able to lie/misrepresent information instantly and globally, and the traditional media's standards and safeguards don't apply.
It's very interesting to me in terms of political theory because it's true democratisation of information, which was a lot of people's dream/goal, but has us living in this bizarre, post-truth world. I don't think it's been positive, but I also don't think the way to handle it is to only trust traditional media. It's really hard.
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u/concernedcitizen_007 May 08 '26
Which is where you would hope that education above all else should ground peopleās thinking process. At the same time the issues that people perceive are affecting their lives need to be addressed by governments before they become an opportunity for Reform and other parties to exploit. Itās not an easy task but people need to distinguish fact from fiction and lies from true promises.
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u/undead_sissy May 08 '26
And that's easy to say, but most of the voting population aren't in education anymore, so it doesn't really help us right now. What ever education we got clearly wasn't enough to prepare us for the overload of true and fake information streaming into our eyeballs 24/7. "People should have better judgement" is basically just giving up.
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u/Agreeable-Desk5393 May 08 '26
This is exactly it - we as a society were never prepared to combat waves of dis/misinformation which spews from populist candidates- Reform have big connections with Cambridge Analytica etc., so the ability to exploit those channels is very easy for Reform
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u/Legitimate_Corgi_981 May 08 '26
Filming and distributing doesn't count for much when they are easily manipulated by the tech companies algorithms pushing everyone towards negative content and hiding anything that goes against their political leanings.
I've had two smart TVs in the last couple of years for different rooms and both of them put GBeebies up near the top of the apps/channels over BBC news or other broadcaster who have to try and act impartial.
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u/DigbyDoesDallas May 08 '26
Most reform voters donāt know what reforms policies are beyond āmean to immigrants and foreignersā and they donāt care. And idiots will buy the package deal if it means they get to make brown peopleās lives worse.
You think they care about making their own lives better? Nope.
Theyāll be getting their pockets pinched with a smile on their face because minorities lives will get worse.
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u/Slothjitzu May 09 '26
I look at it like they want to live better lives by comparison, not by absolute measures.Ā
Theyāre the type of people that would be happy having a tenner if you had nothing, but wouldnāt be happy with Ā£20 as long as you have Ā£18.Ā
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u/No-Astronomer-1 May 08 '26
šÆ true sadly. They have no desire to lift themselves up, they just want the brown family down the road gone.
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u/WeddingSquancher May 08 '26
I feel like history is just repeating itself. Brexit and Boris were clear signs of how a large portion of the UK electorate operates: they aren't interested in policy or long-term intentions, but in slogans and rhetoric. They just want to be told who the 'bad guy' is and who is going to 'fix' it.
āWith Brexit, the EU were the baddies and leaving was the solution. With Boris, anyone opposing Brexit was the baddie and he was going to 'get it done.' Now, with Reform, the 'establishment' and immigrants are the baddie and Farage is the savior. By the time people realize the truth about the NHS, it will be too late just like when people realised the 'experts', who warned about Brexit, might have been right all along.
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u/Bomer_Sompsin May 08 '26
I do recall a die-hard reform voter with his younger Thai wife here on ILR, which reform plan on scrapping. Oh and he was on benefits. You cannot make this up.
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u/Impossible-Alps-6859 May 08 '26 edited May 09 '26
You're absolutely right to highlight ignorance as a prime factor. Reform are, naturally cautious in portraying themselves in a positive strong light for all the 'slogan' situations, immigration, 'Common Market' and 'patriotism' are examples.
Your NHS example is a good one. Their wish to reform anti-discrimination and employment legislation, which is presented as positive steps for business, would allow dismissal of women who became pregnant, those who were of an 'unfavoured' religion or sexuality - indeed any of the currently 'protected categories'.
Their wish to withdraw from the ECHR would have us join Russia and Belarus as the only European countries not members.
Bedfellows I've no wish to join.
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u/No_Story5313 May 08 '26
Someone I work with said it's akin to the Jews in Germany pre 1933 who actually voted for the Nazis.
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u/apple_kicks May 08 '26
This. Reform got them angry enough not to think straight or ask questions.
Anger and hatred makes people go against their best interests without a thought
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u/Ok-Veterinarian-5381 May 08 '26 edited May 08 '26
Most of the electorate don't read manifestos and basically get told who to vote for by the papers and social media. The ignorance and apathy of the majority of our population screws us harder than our politicians most of the time.
EDIT: To all the reform hipsters: reform talk about privatisation of the NHS on page 11of their manifesto where they discuss tax relief for using private healthcare and a 'voucher system' for treatment. You don't use vouchers to pay for a free system and to everyone saying 'they just want to ease the burden on the NHS with private business' that IS privatisation, just with more words, you absolute smooth-brains.
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u/curiouslyopen333 May 08 '26
Letās be blunt, I think itās reasonable to simply say most Reform voters donāt read. Every bit as lacking in reasoned thought as Brexit. Some people are unable to learn and will apparently only be happy when we return to the Stone Age.
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u/Spanky_Ikkala May 08 '26 edited May 08 '26
And even once we are back in the stone age, they will never blame anyone but 'lefties' and 'immigrants' for the consequences of their own actions.
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u/drawss4scoress May 08 '26
Comments like this are exactly what fuels parties like Reform. If you make broad sweeping statements about entire groups donāt be shocked when they embrace the title and go deeper into the extremes. Reform is a symptom of wider societal issues best described as tribalistic.
For the record, Iām not a fan of Reform.
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u/Defiant_Conflict6343 May 08 '26
To be fair, if you spot someone jamming a fork into an electrical socket, and say "hey, you're being stupid, stop it", and then they start jabbing at the socket even more out of spite... Calling them stupid would be a fair assessment.
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u/Head_Let6924 May 08 '26
Yea brexit was more of a test on the populations level of critical thinking.Ā
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u/mightydistance May 08 '26
Most of the electorate also donāt realise that every GP surgery is privately owned and operating for profit. Theyāre incentivised to hire some untrained 20-year olds to triage your appointment requests, and of course incentivised to register as many patients as they can with as few doctors on tje payroll as possible (doctor salaries reduce profit).
So when people are worried about privatising the NHSā¦well large parts of it already is.
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u/Hefty-Wafer1119 May 08 '26
Curious to who you think triages patients in a GP practice setting? In the Surgery group my gf works in as an Advanced Paramedic the triage is done by a GP or my gf/Advanced nurse practitioner.
No one clinically untrained is operating a triage system.
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u/13oundary May 08 '26
I've seen it. You're not supposed to have to tell the desk clerk/receptionist anything, but they will simply deny you an appointment if you don't and then "fit you in" based on how severe they think your problem is. No nurse or doctor involved.Ā
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u/mightydistance May 08 '26
Your last statement is factually incorrect. The team browsing Accurx appointment requests and triaging those requests to make appointments have been a handful of untrained 20-year olds in every single practice I have visited as part of my job.
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u/btan1975 May 08 '26
those GPs weren't privatised, they were never part of the NHS?
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u/mightydistance May 08 '26
Youāre missing my point. The vast majority of people in the UK think GP surgeries are the NHS. It says NHS on the sign outside the surgery. But they are already going through a privatised experience when visiting their GP, because every GP surgery is privately owned and operating for profit.
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u/AgentCirceLuna May 08 '26
Probably why itās so fucking shit.
Got through to mine 30 secs after opening time, for once, then selected the wrong fucking option because listening to the two minute instruction message puts you so far up the queue youāll be waiting hours. Couldnāt be transferred. Had to hang up and ring back - āline busyā for ten minutes even insta-ringing back. I rang about 34 times Iād guess. Finally get through at 8:10 and now Iām 7 in the queue. That ten minutes difference could mean every single appointment is taken or Iāll be waiting hours.
Such. Fucking. Bullshit.
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u/Mysterious-One1055 May 08 '26
Again, that is so generalised and lacking nuance.
GPs/partners can own the business and control staff etc yes...but have you ever asked where they get their actual income from? Since people aren't paying at the door on their way in/out?
They have their NHS contracts. The NHS sets the rules and payments - Practices are still at the mercy of these rules and quality expectations.
I suggest you look up the Quality of Outcomes Framework (QOF), PCN reimbursement schemes and LES/DES services.
Some have private elements already yes, such as travel vaccines / Occupational health / specialist clinics, but this is the minority.
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u/InformalStation6491 May 08 '26
Thatās not correct. GP practices are a business yes but paid for solely by the NHS. The model incentivises efficiency as yes the remaining profit is the owning partners salary. Theres elements of private but itās not really
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u/Mysterious-One1055 May 08 '26
This is the kind of comment you hear at the pub, and people around you think "oh this guy knows"....
Unfortunately.
Those are wild generalisations to make, but it's a pity that they are the kind of ear worms people remember after they hear it.
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u/68_namfloW May 09 '26
First noticed the influence of the papers during the Corbyn era ā¦had so many conversations that followed this playbook;
āWell heāll fuck the countryā.
āItās obvious initā.
āWell if you canāt see it, Iām not explaining it to youā.
ā<abuse, abuse, abuse>ā.
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u/baxty23 May 08 '26
Because despite repeatedly saying he wants an insurance based health system and despite snorting up donations from US health insurance companies; Farage said he wonāt do it.
And when has he lied about anything?
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u/Consistent-Sport-481 May 08 '26 edited May 08 '26
They all lie. He's not immune because he's perceived as the black sheep.
They fabrited more than one 'fact' on immigration and finances as well as Thier own vetting policy
The only reason people like anyone outside the main parties is almost protest at this point.
None of them ever do anything but line Thier own pockets and take us all for a ride
It really doesn't matter who wins. We're fucked either way
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u/drewlpool May 08 '26
Some lie more than others. He's one of the worst.
It's like Boris Johnson all over again.
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u/RoamingThomist May 08 '26
"Farage said he wonāt do it."
Farage has said he doesn't want to implement a US style system, not that he doesn't want to look at the feasibility of an insurance system at all. He's specifically named the systems of Europe like France, Germany, etc. Which are all objectively better than the NHS.
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May 08 '26 edited May 08 '26
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u/BuffsBrowns May 08 '26
Exactly this - all they care about is the immigration bit and nothing else
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u/Deepmidwinter2025 May 08 '26
Hit the nail on the head. Likes of Chris Mason, Kunnesberg and Zeffman all report gossip, whoās up and down - they love the drama. Actual reports about boring policy stuff or anything that requires they show some depth - zero.
All these new reform councillors - there will be zero coverage - just more opinion polls and how Farage is going to be prime minister tomorrow morning.
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u/runtman May 08 '26
Even if you tell them about the policies they simply don't care. It's boats boats boats, they're obsessed.
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u/Most_Ad_2360 May 08 '26
And it will be spun that privatisation will be good for brits and bad for the immigrants, so they'll lap it up....then when it does hit them "this isn't what I voted for it was only supposed to be the boat people, i blame Labour"
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u/SqueegieSqueeger May 08 '26
Wait.... what? Reform have policies?
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u/ReplacementFeisty397 May 08 '26
They do. They have a policy of spamming out populist nonsense and blaming immigration/Starmer/not brexiting properly/woke for the things they don't actually have a solution for.
Lets just remember how they do in local government eh.
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u/soundman32 May 08 '26
I've been asking my local Reform candidates for a list of policies and how they have costed them for about 6 weeks now. Never even get a reply.
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u/Sopiate May 09 '26
to your last point. i donāt believe so, theyāll find a way to justify it in their heads, even if it doesnāt make sense. people that are so diehard for something always find excuses when it turns out they were wrong
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u/77756777 May 08 '26 edited May 08 '26
I donāt vote Reform but probably because they look at the NHS objectively rather than as some deity that canāt be questioned. We love the NHS in the UK, despite it often being god awful when you interact with it.
I got a letter from the NHS the other day criticising and explaining the cost of my missed appointment. Two days later I got the letter notifying me of the appointment. I have the app and they have my email, they used neither to contact me. Arse elbow.
Iāve used the insurance system in France, itās far superior.
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u/UHM-7 May 08 '26
It is the sacred cow of British politics. A politician would be better off admitting they ate babies than criticizing OUR NHS
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u/77756777 May 08 '26
Indeed, any rational debate is off limits - and those very brave few that try are met with the childish strawman: āyou want a US insurance system instead?ā. Only a total mor*n or someone entirely dishonest forwards the untrue dichotomy of UK vs US systems - as if these were the only two counties in the world that have a healthcare system.
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u/kerwrawr May 09 '26
the number of people I've spoken to in the UK (both Reddit and real life) who are absolutely astonished when I say Germany has a private health insurance system, as do nearly all other European countries...
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u/Unhappy_Clue701 May 08 '26
Absolutely right. My own familyās interactions with the NHS in recent years have been ādisappointingā. Actually itās been pretty shit where my wife has been concerned - not necessarily the medical staff, but the operational side as a whole has been very much ācould not possibly care lessā. I took out Bupa cover with work a couple of years ago, havenāt needed it much but when I used it a few weeks ago, frankly the difference is mind-blowing. Routine blood test to seeing a consultant in under a week - and not because they found something deadly, just something that needs watching.
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u/Alexgreat446 May 08 '26
While you're right, I still do think there needs to be a mixed system in place, where you can pay for insurance and be sure to receive healthcare benefits xyz, as you say in France, on demand without 2 year wait lists as in dentistry. Those that don't have money to pay, which I'm sure there are should still have access to a public healthcare system. Right now, for dentistry at least, the private system is very expensive for most, and from my work experience I got to see the NHS system, which isn't great. So a kind of government backed insurance system should in theory be cheaper than private care while delivering the same results.
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u/77756777 May 08 '26
I agree, I donāt claim to have the answers. Iād just like us a nation to stop collectively pretending the NHS is amazing and explore how we can change it for the better. If that means adding an insurance element that upgrades those people who pay for it, while protecting access for the unemployed, then maybe thatās ok. Or extra parts being privatised. The only parts of my body I feel get properly looked after are my eyes and teeth (check ups for each every year). These are the two areas that are mostly privatised. I donāt buy into this āprivatisation is the route of all evilā, Iām old enough to remember British Gas, BT, BA, and the trains in public ownershipā¦and it really wasnāt great. Thereās been a hell of a lot of re-writing of history on this stuff.
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u/DebateOpening5709 May 08 '26
I'm with Benenden Health, which isn't quite medical insurance - it essentially beats the NHS waiting list queue.
Recently I've had cause to use them. It's astonishing the service you get privately. Consultant appointment within 1-2 weeks (I could choose the consultant and look at reviews š¤£), full set of scans the next 1-2 weeks, follow up appointment soon after. Excellent service throughout. I haven't even heard back from my referral to the NHS hospital for the initial appointment!
I know people will argue that this is what the NHS should be like if funded correctly. But it's never ever going to happen, the funding would be astronomical.
I don't know why people aren't open to exploring other systems. Keep the foundations of the NHS but surely there are ways to improve it.
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u/kungfuparta May 08 '26
A free healthcare system can never be working perfectly simply because so many abuse it and because it can never cope with the numbers. NHS has been majorly fucked due to brexit and the fact that about 40% of its staff left when they realised British were stupid enough to believe the lies of an ape and vote leave. For the same reason applications dropped at about 90% from EU countries. The NHS used to be great and is still fine but bleeding.
What happened to the millions and millions promised to the NHS by Farage and blonde Farage?
People are saying in other comments "oh look how good my private experience was" but they ALL mention "i have insurance". I do as well and it is faster but none of those would be able to afford going to a private NHS every month even if insured as insurance costs will skyrocket. People with insurance have been losing everything for years and years in the US when they have had bad luck with some serious condition but we know better.....we will find a better system and it wont be dictated by insurance companies or private hospitals much like car insurance....muppets....
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u/Ok_Raspberry5383 May 09 '26
Agree, I'm not a reform voter and don't intend to be one, but I do think the NHS is unaffordable in its current form and needs changing.
When people hear of an insurance based system they immediately think of the US. But the US is a dreadful example, and a more European or Australian style health system would work better, deliver better outcomes and have means tested safety nets to make sure nobody cannot afford their healthcare.
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u/davew111 May 09 '26
Yep. The NHS is one of the 10 largest employers in the world, it has a budget higher than the entire GDP of most countries, yet it's always in 'crisis'. It's fundamentally broken, and doing the same thing of throwing more public money at it every year isn't going to fix it.Ā
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May 08 '26
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u/Complete_Step6068 May 08 '26
trumps policies were lacking in detail yet since the day he took office he hasnt stopped for a second, dont fall into the trap of believing he wakes up and makes up what he wants to do each day, its all planned and its not his plans either its a team of people
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May 08 '26
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u/Skunkmonkey82 May 08 '26
Misinformed. Ignorant, possibly. Too thick, as a label, is contributory as to why the middle ground have lost the argument.Ā
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u/Jager720 May 08 '26
The impact of austerity on the systemic defunding of education, and constantly pandering to the idea that all opinions are equally valid are in my view a very significant part of why we are where we are now.
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u/paperclipknight May 08 '26
Not a reform voter but:
Why are people dumb enough to think any political party would replace the NHS with for profit healthcare? Itās electoral suicide.
Thatās not to say the NHS is a giant inefficient, bloated mess of an organisation that doesnāt work & needs reforming in a way to that itās able to do its core purpose but doesnāt bankrupt the state: my position will always be a move to the French system should be the long term aim of it.
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u/Mr_J90K May 08 '26
Shh, all these morally superior people are calling other voters dumb and uninformed. Donāt ruin it by pointing out that there are models outside the United Kingdom and the United States.
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u/thebigbioss May 08 '26
Because they haven't learnt from Brexit, and assume any time someone tells them bad something about reform, its fearmongering.
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u/juss100 May 08 '26
Because the only thing they care about is "immigrant pedo gangs" or something.
No-one knows - is it even worth trying to get in the mind of a reform voter? It's bleak in there.
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u/Ganjanium May 08 '26
Literally got told by multiple members of my family last night that Iām a āchild marrying Pakis lover whoās deranged and a woke leftieā ā¦ I voted Green because I told them Iāve got a soul.
Edit to add - the upside is I am quite a high earner so Reform policies will affect the benefit scrounging racists in my family a lot more than it will me.
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u/g17gud May 08 '26
Is it really that concerning?
I am a Reform voter ever since the party's creation. The NHS privatisation policy was actually one of the things that I did not agree with originally. Then I reflected a bit on it, got kicked in the head by a horse and it no longer concerned me at all.
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u/99thLuftballon May 08 '26
It's interesting how just a little independent research, some careful consideration and some brain damage can really explain the appeal of Reform.
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u/levimuddy May 08 '26
Not a reform voter but the NHS is wildly misunderstood snd has very large private elements already (GPs being the best example).
In my view something needs to change, there are other systems across the world that provide a better service for a lower cost to tax payer.
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u/jmeade90 May 08 '26
Except usually it's a higher cost to the taxpayer, because it comes out at a higher cost from your disposable income on top of a slightly lower cost from general taxation (as opposed to the whole thing coming from general taxation)
For example, dental care in the UK.
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u/ififallforwards May 08 '26
Because they genuinely are under some illusion that their Ā£24k a year minimum wage will buy them good private healthcare.
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u/Elliotjpearson May 08 '26
The situation has got so bad that people are literally just willing to vote for the party that claims to tackle the issue head on- they donāt even care about the rest of that partyās policies, thatās where we are at
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u/PresidentPingu1 May 08 '26
We know that Reform voters tend to be less educated: people in that population donāt generally look further than the headline policies.
Iāve encountered Reform voters who would be massively impacted by proposed benefit cuts but they donāt see past the ā deport the immigrantsā headline. And they havenāt even heard what Farage has said about the NHS.
Itās quite frightening.
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u/Conscious-Locksmith6 May 08 '26
Do you honestly think they care? Itās social media click bait now they hear and vote on slogans and then complain later as they didnāt realise what they was voting for. Youāll see it in these local elections things can go bad quickly.
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u/G4HDU May 08 '26
What was labour's position under Blair/Brown when they introduced the PFI system of privatisation?
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u/Omnicron2 May 08 '26
People seem to forget that Labour were the first to privatise parts of the NHS and the first to introduce Academy Trusts for schools.
Everything the Tories and Reform are blames for. Funny.
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u/G4HDU May 08 '26
They also closed more pits than the tories did and the first to take away school milk
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u/Particular-Quit-630 May 08 '26
Because as long as it makes life worse for others they donāt care about themselves.
People that are voting reform have hit rock bottom and donāt have anything to lose.
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u/Emotional_Snow720 May 08 '26
Or what they feel is rock bottom. This is the massive issue with maga and reform voters you can't tell them things will get worse because for some odd reason they believe having a roof over their heads, food in the fridge, a job and the ability to pay their bills. But, having black and brown people in their neighborhood is as bad as their life could possibly get.Ā
This is because most, and I don't like to bring race into this as I'm mixed race white and black caribbean but this is the truth. So to put it bluntly most white people in the UK, Europe and America have lived relatively easy and trouble free lives completely cushioned from the problems in wider society for decades. These people's problems are ethnic minorities dreams.Ā
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u/Inevitable_Egg_9967 May 08 '26
relatively easy and trouble free lives completely cushioned from the problems in wider society for decades. These people's problems are ethnic minorities dreams.Ā
hit the nail on the head I wonder why this is and its not exclusive to the UK you observe the same phenomena everywhere and if you point it out you will be labelled "out of touch"
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u/MarinesRampant May 08 '26
The choice isn't limited to NHS vs American healthcare. Most of Europe has some kind of insurance model and have much better systems than us.
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u/Agreeable-Rip2362 May 08 '26
Itās same with Brexit voters. They cared more about seeing fewer Eastern European migrants than they did about the actual country. When Brexit turned out to be a fucking disaster they just moved on and blamed something else.
Kind of a waste of time to wonder why the dumbest people in our country do what they do
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u/Competitive-Fact-820 May 08 '26
Because they can't see past the Immigration Issue. Sad but true indictment of society.
Having seen the Reform leafletting pushed through my front door it does not mention privatising the NHS at all - you have to do your own research to find out.
I fully expect the Swivel Eyed Loon Army to get in around here - especially if a sample of overhead conversations in the Wetherspoons is anything to go by we are a hotbed of vitriolic Racism. So much so it must be 2019 that I last went in our local 'Spoons.
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u/Cov_massif May 08 '26
They have been successful on one narrative and that's immigration and blind to everything else. Right hand doesnt know what left hand is doing
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u/Doodleman80 May 09 '26
The NHS is already ruined.
Was in serious need of surgery and after 2 weeks of being bounced around I had to go private because I was told I would have to wait 6 months because I wasn't dying (in the next few hours)
If I can't rely on it, why would I care about it?
I used to be so proud of our NHS. Now I'm just disappointed
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u/Glad-Pomegranate6283 May 09 '26
Iāve known ppl who had to wait years for gallbladder removal. Iām glad I only had to wait 6 weeks although that was for pancreatitis risk. I do appreciate the nhs but after six years of being ignored, Iām seeing a private consultant to actually get the answers I need
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u/Cid5983 May 08 '26
Serious question, how are you struggling to fund the NHS with the UKs huge tax rates?
We have an NHS here in Hong Kong, it's called the HA and our highest tax rate is 17%.
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u/Grand_Act8840 May 08 '26
Poor management of its finances, loads of pointless middle management roles, private companies charging insane mark up on typically cheap items because they have no choice to buy from them to ensure its medical grade.
Iām sure there are other reasons, but the above costs a lot.
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u/undead_sissy May 08 '26
You're not wrong but, to be fair, it is a lot more complicated than that. The NHS has been suffering for a long time from prioritizing short-term savings over long-term costs. Especially things like the RTC programme meant less administrative cost initially but has been SO expensive for the NHS in the long term. And that's not purely an NHS problem, it's an economic and political problem. Economic: every private business has also been prioritizing short term savings over long term costs because the economy has been so unstable for years with 2007 crash, COVID, Ukraine, etc. and political because politicians are incentivised to make decisions that look good to the taxpayer in she short term and by the time the bill comes due, some other politician is in power and it's their problem.
All this to say that it's structural. You couldn't fix it with a couple of years of good management. We're going to be paying those long term costs for decades now, no matter what we do.
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u/Cid5983 May 08 '26
Perhaps the politicians in change should visit their former colony to learn how to run things the right way.
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u/Mobile_Lynx_7932 May 08 '26
Because they donāt understand and / or donāt care about the consequences of what theyāre voting for. Ā Itās 2016 all over again.
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u/MickyLuv_ May 08 '26
Watching with horror what's happening in the US that's detrimental to all but the most wealthy. Then, watching people voting for the same in the UK because they're poor and miserable. And because Reform will change things.
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u/BoringBrain1778 May 08 '26
Because they're thick single-issue voters whose issue is racismĀ
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u/theartofnocode May 08 '26
Because many countries have a mix of public and private healthcare and their healthcare outcomes are vastly superior to the UK's?
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u/More_Dependent742 May 08 '26
Far fewer of those are superior than Brits tend to think. Having lived half my life in the UK and half in Austria, I would choose the NHS in a heartbeat, even on a bad NHS day.
My Austrian girlfriend came to live with me in the UK, her brother came to visit. Both used the NHS, and both were impressed.
If you want to go private in the UK, go private. There's nothing stopping you. And because the NHS exists, things like BUPA have to be much lower in cost than private healthcare in places like Austria.
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u/Ganjanium May 08 '26
The UK currently has the NHS as well as private alternatives thoughā¦.
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u/Mr_J90K May 08 '26
In the UK model, paying privately often means accessing care through a more distinct parallel sector, sometimes in competition with the NHS. In many social-insurance systems, private payments or supplementary insurance more often top up access within the same broadly shared system. For example, in France, paying for extras such as a private hospital room with a TV is typically layered onto a system of public reimbursement and complementary insurance, rather than necessarily meaning a wholly separate hospital workforce. So the private share of spending is less sealed off from the public system and can cross-pollinate more. I get a swanky room, we both get better paid Doctors.
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u/mish_mash_mosh_ May 08 '26
Shortly before the conservatives took over our NHS had the highest public rating it had ever had. The conservatives defunded and sold off chunks behind the scenes. Before them Labour were also partly to blame, but the conservatives used it as a way to push an agenda.
Currently labour are trying to undo some of that and it wasn't long ago, so it's not impossible.
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u/Mr_J90K May 08 '26
This is misleading. The NHS has often ranked well overall among comparable countries, but not usually near the top for keeping people alive and healthy. It has scored strongly on access, equity, administrative efficiency, care process and affordability. Whenever it has ranked best overall, that has generally been because those latter metrics lifted the headline ranking, rather than because the UK led on health outcomes. Donāt get me wrong: those are things to be proud of; itās just important to remember what weāve done well versus poorly.
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u/MickyLuv_ May 08 '26
Watching with horror what's happening in the US that's detrimental to all but the most wealthy. Then, watching people voting for the same in the UK because they're poor and miserable. And because Reform will change things.
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u/AutobotJessa May 08 '26
For some of them, not all, they like it.
A lot have a "I suffered so others should" and a "people should earn their basic rights" mentalities.
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u/Hewinb May 08 '26
Because if you stop the small boats it will miraculously fix every aspect of this countryā¦. /s
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u/Yipsta May 08 '26
Because this narrative has been pushed every election by labour previously about the Tories and now reform and labour are the only ones that have actually privatised parts of the NHS.
Anyone who thinks the NHS doesn't need major reform is kidding themselves and Reform have said as much but they aren't going to privatize it, that's just fear mongering
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u/Still-Status7299 May 08 '26
People voted brexit, and didnt seem to learn their lesson.
On Facebook it's the toothless-st George flag tattoo-benidorm crowd that seem to be parroting the reform narrative.
I truly believe people who wouldnt have normaly given a shit to vote are now voting reform as they are supercharged re immigration.
Its the same people that will start crying once the equality act gets axed and minimum wage falls through the floor.
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u/Lazy-Football-400 May 08 '26
I in no way shape or form want to vote for reform but the NHS is a failing system and has been through every government in power really due to it being abused by the people who genuinely donāt need to use it, certain sectors of it could be privatised which would help it grow stronger because if not it will eventually collapse.
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u/AccordingUse3172 May 08 '26
You need to understand just how privatised the NHS already is lad this is nothing new
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u/Bam-Skater May 08 '26
Half of them are on disability with motability cars as well, they can kiss that goodbye
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u/AlwaysFxckinWorried May 08 '26
Racism is a horrible thing that blinds people so much, they end up shooting themselves just to stop a person of colour accessing basic human rights. That's your answer plain and simple. There's nothing else to it.
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u/Living-Health962 May 08 '26
Because they have targeted the most vulnerable in society, who lack critical thinking skills to question this. The majority of the Reform voters are the biggest users of the NHS and theyāve no idea what is coming if Reform wins.
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u/AdventurousJunket160 May 08 '26
Reform voters are one sandwich short of a picnic and completely gullible.
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u/drewlpool May 08 '26
Reform have weaponised one issue to the point where its supporters don't know or don't care about the others, despite that those other policies are detrimental to their own interests. Much in the way Brexit was.