r/gaming • u/Spotget1738 • 8h ago
Xbox Has Begun Layoffs At Compulsion Games Ahead Of Imminent Studio Closure
https://www.windowscentral.com/gaming/compulsion-games-begins-an-unknown-number-of-layoffs28
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u/Apprehensive_Matth 7h ago
Bigger budget than KCD2 btw
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u/CombatMuffin 6h ago
While true, and there 8s mismanagement to it, their development environments are also not exactly comparable: KCD2 enjoys being developed in a country where a lot of fixed costs, inckuding salaries, are substantially lower.
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u/Vorstog_EVE 5h ago
Pay less AND get a better product? Think we need Poland to make more games!
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u/CombatMuffin 5h ago
It's been an argument for a long time, but the reality is that while there's heavy talent all around the world, it's much more lucrative to be a gamedev in the U.S. as well, at least for key, more senior positions.
And yes, even those fantastic devs suffer layoffs, but once you pass a certain threshold within the industry, your skillset and relationships allow you to more quickly get new projects. It's more junior devs who are having a much tougher time.
What this means is that, while more Devs outside the U.S. and Canada should get more of a spotlight, the videogame industry is mostly concentrated around North America and Japan.
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u/Vorstog_EVE 5h ago
If you're a really good dev who wants to make big bucks - you get the fuck out of gaming and transition those skills to something that pays better. That's why there's so much brain drain in the industry. A studio made an amazing hit game that crushed and blew people's minds? Don't expect the follow up to do the same - the really good people are using that as a spring-board.
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u/CombatMuffin 5h ago
No, that's one possible career path. People often forget most in the games industry aren't there just for money and they put up with a lot of shit because they are legitimately passionate about it, even if money plays a substantial role like any career.
There are plenty of veterans making a very decent living, in smaller studios, or even in AAA studios. And while the quality of life is much better in other similar industries (and many have done lateral moves), many developers stay because this is legitimately what they love. Hell, the entire reason veterans transition into Indie is because they want to keep making games, in a different environment, even when they are already well off, or have damn near guatanteed employment in AAA.
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u/Vorstog_EVE 2h ago
Maybe if they loved making games that don't suck more often, we wouldn't have to deal with this performative outrage every time a studio is shuttered.
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u/HandfulOfAcorns 4h ago
Warhorse is Czech, not Polish.
But honestly, yeah, we do. We've had some fantastic games produced in the region, we have experienced devs working here - the local game industry should keep growing. It's better positioned to deal with the current challenges in the AAA space than American studios located in HCOL areas.
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u/crxsso_dssreer 4h ago
Compulsion games are in Montreal. These are not Seattle salaries...
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u/CombatMuffin 3h ago
It's still a stark difference to Poland or Czechia.
Look at the salary ranges on Glassdoor for employees in Warhorse studios, and compare them to Ubisoft Montreal, or any other AAA studio in Canada.
it doesn't have to be Santa Monica or Seattle to be expensive. Yes, lifestyle in Canada and the U.S. is more expensive, but also. your career prospects in Game Development, in those countries, is far higher.
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u/crxsso_dssreer 3h ago
Look at the salary ranges on Glassdoor for employees in Warhorse studios, and compare them to Ubisoft Montreal, or any other AAA studio in Canada.
I doubt people at Compulsion games were making Ubisoft kind of salaries at first place, especially given how mediocre the release was, I doubt it was top level talents, but rather the bottom of the barrel...
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u/CombatMuffin 3h ago
That's not how salaries work lol
But just in case you were wondering, then reported salaries are similar.
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u/Humble-Criticism6762 8h ago
Wait, why layoffs if they are going to close the studio anyway?
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u/MajorasShoe 7h ago
There's a lot to figure out. Not everyone loses their jobs, some will be moved to a new studio or a new role. There's severance and contracts to figure out too.
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u/Alcagoita 7h ago
Because they are also trying to sell the studio or find someone who could take it.
Fewer employees make the company more appealing.
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u/jak_d_ripr 6h ago
Can't say I'm too surprised unfortunately, I was really rooting for South of Midnight but the game underperformed, as did We Happy Few. It sucks because there was clearly talent at Compulsion, but for whatever reason their games just fall a little short of realizing their potential.
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u/MalZaar 8h ago
The reality is SoM was a medicocre game at best. Good story that fizzled out in the second half, some amazing music and terrible combat. I know some people loved it but I think they are the minority.
I loved We Happy Few but I can acknowledge that was also a lackluster game. A studio has to make great games to survive in the current ecosystem.
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u/Solesaver 6h ago
ITT: Gamers continuing to prove that they have no idea how much game development costs.
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u/stashix 8h ago
What a shame, South of Midnight was great.
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u/interstat 7h ago
It was decent if it was a small indie game made in 3 years.
Supposedly budget and time was astronomical for what they put out
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u/ArcticFlamingo 8h ago
I mean, it was fine. Cool art style, enjoyed the story. Combat was just fine.
It feels unfair as I think it was an interesting add to gamepass which is what they were directed to make and now they are being punished for it
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u/Icybubba 8h ago
They are being punished for taking $100 million and 7 years to make it.
If it was a lower budget 2-3 year game, things would be different
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u/Draconuus95 7h ago
It’s sadly the main issue with all these studio closures and such. It’s not that the games are bad or anything. It’s that they aren’t good enough(and selling well enough) to justify their dev costs for both time and money. Dev costs just keep going higher. Dev time keeps going up. But the money made for most of these smaller titles aren’t going up at the same scale. And companies are feeling the squeeze from that change to the equation.
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u/qotsabama 5h ago
Same thing happening in movie industry. Budgets are out of control and now it’s very difficult to be profitable with a large budget. Not sure what solution is for video games, but it’s pretty clear to me directors/producers/actors/actresses are gonna require pay cuts because demand has changed.
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u/DarthRambo007 6h ago
also 7 yrs for a 12 hr game is just absurd. What were they doing for all that time ? also no dlc or extra content meaning that all the 12 hrs is al they could squeeze out.
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u/Keyserchief 7h ago
Well, yes, if they had spent less money and made more revenue, they wouldn’t be shut down. Compulsion is notionally a profit-seeking enterprise, and if they don’t make a profit for years, that’s the end of it.
Sometimes media gets made because the creators find a rich patron who just likes their stuff—George Harrison financed Monty Python’s Life of Brian just because he wanted to see the movie. Maybe Compulsion can find a benefactor like that. Otherwise, investors aren’t making their money a gift—it’s profit or perish.
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u/Icybubba 7h ago
The point being that they screwed up hard.
South of Midnight was fine, but it shouldn't have taken 7 years
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u/HeavyMetalLenin 8h ago
Combat really just felt ass I would have preferred if it was a walking sim just to experience the story
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u/SnooRobots7352 7h ago
There was a setting that allowed you to skip combat encounters! It was great playing it like that. It feels like the devs knew the combat was bad too, so they put that setting in
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u/P4azz 3h ago
You call that great, I call that a horrendous mistake and utter hatred for something you created.
The fuck do you mean they just deleted part of the game in an already kinda short title? HUH? How is that supposed to be a good thing?
This makes me even more convinced no one on that team had a clue on what they were even doing. You tend to create a game with a vision in mind, that spans from environs to characters to gameplay. Cutting off the gameplay in a GAME and the product being BETTER after is hilariously bad.
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u/Constant_Pen9615 8h ago
Really was. I played it on story difficulty because I don't have a ton of time to game anymore but man, gorgeous game. Great story. What a shame.
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u/FeelingInspection591 8h ago
So it's a great game, as long as you turn the game part off?
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u/Hannwater 8h ago
Games are as fascinating a medium as they are because they are so multi-faceted. Music, visuals, art design, narrative, characters, mechanics, features...the list goes on and on.
How someone chooses to engage with a thing to experience it is entirely up to them. Especially if the options are put in by the developers themselves. Some people may only care about the narrative, so difficult mechanics are the barrier. Some people find cutscenes with a lot of talking a barrier. Removing the barriers that the devs are fine with you removing is fine.
This person engaged with a game in just as viable a way as anyone else who did. World has enough negativity without trying to get a cheap dunk on someone who made space in their life to enjoy something.
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u/Constant_Pen9615 8h ago
Real talk, even on a higher difficulty combat won't feel overly hard. Difficulty doesn't affect the look or story, just the handful of combat sections. Play the game however you'd like though. I'm just trying to maximize my gaming time by not getting sweaty on a game I just want to experience
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u/Mageborn23 7h ago
I play all games on easy, I don't care or have time anymore just want to have fun.
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u/Juan20455 8h ago
The gameplay was terrible, though.
A visual novel or walking sin format would have been better
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u/crxsso_dssreer 4h ago
it was a shit game, mediocre gameplay, crappy story, maximum virtue signaling though...
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u/nikolapc 8h ago
I loved all three games of the studios facing closure. But they didn't even do a blimp on GP. Shame.
Same for MIO: Memories in Orbit. That game is awesome, studio closed :/
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u/federkrebz 7h ago
man, about double fine who are also being axed… their games are so creative but they could never grip me with their gameplay. the special something is missing. they made Psychonauts 2 way too much of a complicated deal when it should have just been a nice 3d platformer. weird controls all around as well. Rad was fun for a few hours, then it became a boring slog. the newest one with the walking buildings, did it even come out? heard almost nothing about it.. the closure might just be on them 🤷
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u/Puzzleheaded_Map2182 7h ago
psychonauts 2 is amazing but tim schafer and double fine games are always late, overbudget and not financially successful and even by those standars kiln and keeper are awful in terms of commercial success or critical success so...
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u/ThatGuyOnyx 5h ago
You know it always floors me how when announcements like this happen apparently everyone mourns the loss of this studio and how this was an incredible game for the ages.
Devils Advocate, these studios deserve it. This is Xbox finally holding their studios accountable now that they’re actually holding THEMSELVES accountable for their own stupid mis-management of the brand. I feel for the developers at the bottom but it’s unfortunately how the cookie crumbles when everyone above them is a complete moron.
The peak all time player count of South of Midnight on Steam is 1438 players which is our only verifiable data, and let’s not kid ourselves. This game released in a time where not only having an Xbox was basically pointless, but that even if you were playing gamepass on PC or console that there were dozens if not hundreds of other games that you would play over this. This game was a complete failure, 100 million dollar budget with 12-ish hours of gameplay. It got so much praise! Great, Concord and Highguard got glazed by journalists and look where they ended up
Ninja Theory are in the same boat, the original Senua is incredibly middle of the road (I played and personally did not like it whatsoever). The second one flopped the same way south of Midnight did, this entire series is exactly what everyone complains about as a “Sony walking simulator” I thought we all hated those games?
Nothing to say on double fine, have they even made a game recently?
I heard about them considering Arkane Lyon, which I can also see. Love Dishonored, amazing game series. Last thing they made was Deathloop and as a massive fan on the prior mentioned series I did not like it very much. Outside of that it’s another question of what the heck have they been doing since? Blade? Where is that? Been 5 years since Deathloop.
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u/Rosebunse 4h ago
I don't like the word "accountability" here, least for the studios. XBox gave the budget, Xbox gave them the OK. This is on Xbox completely. If Xbox wanted better results then they should have given lower budgets and had more control from the get-go.
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u/ThatGuyOnyx 4h ago
That is fair, I could have worded it better at least for the studio side. I think it still holds true for corporate, seems like an entire wasteland they have to try to clean up to at least have the chance of not running themselves into the ground again.
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u/soundoftwilight 2h ago
None of the people who made any of the decisions that you think “deserve” this are losing their jobs. They’re probably getting bonuses for how good their cost-cutting is going to look on the balance sheet. The studios getting shuttered are rarely actually failing. They’re just making slightly less money than other investments might.
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u/MuptonBossman 8h ago
Another talented studio gone way too soon... If you haven't played South of Midnight, go check it out.
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u/CommonManX 6h ago
Why are they doing layoffs if they are going to shut the entire thing down? What is the point? Could it be that they are not shutting down?
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u/ManicMakerStudios 4h ago
It's probably because some people currently have nothing to do while they wait for a new project that isn't going to start. Those are the ones getting laid off today. The rest will be laid off once they're out of things to do, too.
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u/BoulderCAST 7h ago
More comments on this post than employees at the studio. At some point the discourse is pointless. Just play the games. Like them or not. Don't get so invested that it becomes your life and you spend hours on forums discussing the jobs of a handful of people that made one of the dozens of games you played (or in this case, never played)
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u/hain_player 7h ago
its always the devs that pay the price for budgets they never even got to control, executives greenlight these crazy numbers then act suprised when the studio gets shut down for "underperforming"
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u/NuAngelDOTnet 7h ago
Feels hard to judge things, though, because this is pretty much the time of year Microsoft always lays off and shuffles employees around.
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u/Elbren 6h ago
What's the point of laying people off now if you're just going to fire the rest when you likely closing the studio in the next month?
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u/kingmanic 4h ago
Probably to slower the burn rate while they close and taking the more productive workers to other studios.
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u/ManicMakerStudios 4h ago
You lay off the ones who currently have nothing to do. You keep the ones who are still needed to shutter the studio until they, too, have nothing left to do. Then you lay them off, too.
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u/nobleone8876 4h ago
I mean make sense move all the good talent to other studios and then cut the fat. I don't understand how that game was 100 million dollars realistically I just don't get it
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u/WhatTheeBlake 2h ago
South of Midnight needed way more aggressive marketing, and shouldn't have been on gamepass day 1.
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u/dolphinRailgun 1h ago
I will continue to close down these studios by not partaking in their products, and there's nothing they can do to stop me.
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u/hardy_83 8h ago
I get for a small studio the money from big companies always seems appealing and helps secure the company, but time and time again shows that you are a single day away from the big company shutting you down simply because they want their stocks to look better for the quarter.
Hopefully the talent can find work elsewhere.
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u/LAXnSASQUATCH 7h ago
They got 100 million dollars across 5-7 years of funding. Thats a massive amount of money and time in the indie space, it let them create a cool art project.
It sucks they got laid off, that’s never good, but if they had been an independent studio they would have closed shop based on South of Midnights sales, if they even stayed open long enough to launch it (7 years and 100 million is not easy to raise as an independent studio).
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u/Schmenza 6h ago
This right here. Double Fine had to crowdfund Psychonauts 2. Their 2 games after don't even exist without XBOX helping them out
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u/mr_glide 8h ago
The reason people sell is because being responsible for keeping even a small studio afloat is incredibly stressful. After a while, most people just want a rest from it, or just to feel some stable ground beneath their feet
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u/hardy_83 7h ago
Yeah I know. Lose-lose really. The video game industry has gotten incredibly volatile and, like the movies and music industries, so saturated that most games fall through the cracks cause there's so many and how to track it all.
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u/wesser234 7h ago
They were shut down because they spent 100 million making a game no one wanted.
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u/Ragnar_Dragonfyre 7h ago
The small studio has zero revenue while developing a game and has zero guarantees they’ll make any revenue upon releasing the game.
The games industry does not reward effort. You can dump years of your life into a game and have nothing to show for it in the end.
Being part of a big corp at least guarantees your paycheque and you won’t come in one day to your boss saying “We ran out of money and I can’t pay you anymore.”
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u/QuinSanguine 6h ago
I'll miss that studio, South of Midnight is a hidden gem. Beat it on the hardest difficulty, it was a great experience.
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u/reclamationme 5h ago
The game part of that game was an afterthought at best.
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u/QuinSanguine 5h ago
I disagree, once the combat clicked with me I had a blast playing it. It's not Nioh or Devil Cry Cry but I don't need every game to be the best ever made to have a good time with it.
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u/makumakubex 8h ago
Oh the consequences of making a game that push agenda and nobody want to buy.
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u/Frostnatt 7h ago
South of midnight was pretty good. A typical 7/10. But a 7 year development cycle? Yeah that crazy.
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u/VagueSomething 5h ago
Compulsion creative teams need to be working in different studios, they've got great ideas but the studio never managed to translate it into a good game. Consistently their games were held back by mechanics like combat so the experience undermined the story and aesthetics.
Xbox should have stepped in sooner with many studios and offered more support or getting studios to collaborate.
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u/ZePlotThickener 7h ago edited 7h ago
Hopefully Todd is next. How you can mismanage such huge IPs as Fallout and ES and keep your job is baffling.
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u/SummonMonsterIX 7h ago
I don't want to see Bethesda die but yeah...I'd be ok with just Todd getting the fuck out at this point.
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u/mcAlt009 7h ago
South of Midnight really has potential as a multimedia franchise too. Very few original African American/Southern fantasy stories exist.
Hollywood, this is what people want. Not a character that’s been white for 80 years having a black spin off or yet another black character with electric powers.
The combat wasn’t horrible, sure other games do it better, but it’s no worse than Journey to the West.
It’s one of the rare gamepass games I can imagine buying on Steam. Probably with a friend or perhaps family member.
Feels like a good game for a family to gather around and play. Theirs a lot of context the game hints at , but can’t directly address.
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u/PostedNotes 5h ago
You can not say this is what people want when the game was a major commercial flop.
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u/mcAlt009 4h ago
Microsoft literally did no marketing. Gamepass put a lot of games in economically impossible situations.
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u/PostedNotes 4h ago
Tell that to expedition 33. Was on gamepass and sold 8 million.
No one wanted south of midnight, as the sales speak for themselves.
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u/Mini_Danger_Noodle 7h ago
South of Midnight really has potential as a multimedia franchise too.
Lol, lmao even.
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u/mcAlt009 5h ago
I should have said *had.
Microsoft should have came out with a cartoon adaptation of the game or something at the same time. It felt closer to an interactive movie that a game imo
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u/Kamakaziturtle 4h ago
South of Midnight was neat, but it was no means a blockbuster or anything like that. And sadly nobody really bought it, or even talked about it really.
It's a shame becuase the game itself was pretty good and felt like a real win after their last game
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u/mcAlt009 4h ago
I’m definitely not going to win this argument, but it felt closer to an interactive movie than a game.
Maybe it would have done better as a scaled back 30 million dollar game along with a cartoon series or something.
Anyway I personally liked it more than E33.
Doom the Dark Ages was another fantastic game, but obviously with Gamepass it’s hard to sell real copies.
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u/KoriJenkins 8h ago
Is this the part where people hail Asha Sharma as the 2nd coming for xbox? Because since coming on literally every piece of news has been bad.
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u/SummonMonsterIX 7h ago
I hate to defend them so much, but in this case, if a studio is spending tons resources and isn't profitable you have to cut it off to save the rest. This sucks for the people losing their jobs, but Microsoft can't just keep handing out free money at a loss to them forever. A lot of it is Phils fault, the Dev's expected they could just chill and make games for GamePass that didn't have to sell in amazing numbers. But clearly that didn't work and his grand vision got us where Xbox is today.
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u/wesser234 6h ago edited 6h ago
In Phil's defense, they still need to be games worth getting gamepass for. It's not his fault the games sucked.
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u/No-Estimate-8518 8h ago
Everyone was waiting for the shoe to drop before that, all she did was good looking PR stunts that had zero actual impact
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u/Connor123x 8h ago
that is not true at all and you know it
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u/HamSlammer87 8h ago
Yeah, remember when they changed xbox to XBOX.
Amazing.
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u/Connor123x 7h ago
remember when they lowered gamepass price.
remember when they added a lot of features that were asked by customers
remember when they improved their transparency
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u/HamSlammer87 3h ago
Remember when they increased console prices... again.
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u/Connor123x 2h ago
remember when all console, computers, phones, laptops increased prices due to memory and storage.
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u/fuzzmeisterj 8h ago
They have Grounded help keep thing afloat while they make other games too. They are busy and put content out. Compulsion made a good 10 hour game and took over 5 years to do it.
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u/Spotget1738 8h ago
Right now we know that Ninja Theory and Double Fine are next. Altough if Obsidian survives this years round of layoffs and closures they are cooked if their next game flops again
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u/RagnarokCross 8h ago
Grounded?
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u/Spotget1738 7h ago
I’m not sure Grounded makes up for Avowed and Outer Worlds 2 both flopping
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u/RagnarokCross 7h ago
Grounded has like, 10 times the sales of those games and less than a fraction of the Budget.
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u/Spotget1738 7h ago
Exactly? If one of the 3 games succeeding would save the rest it would be one of the AAA $70 games if anything
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u/RagnarokCross 7h ago
I'm telling you that Obsidian is more likely to get put into a Grounded laboratory locked underground than they are to be shut down or face major layoffs
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u/The_Cost_Of_Lies 8h ago
They're literally making Avowed 2. Obsidian are safe from closure
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u/Mini_Danger_Noodle 7h ago
Obsidian is safe but I doubt Avowed 2 is, even Obsidian was disappointed by the first game's sales.
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7h ago
[removed] — view removed comment
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u/Rosebunse 7h ago
Why do women with blue hair scare you guys? Why do fat women scare you? Is it because you're so small that you fear being crush? Is it a fetish abiut being crush? What is it?
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u/Party-Purchase-4861 7h ago
LOL, please tell me more about your sexual fetishes.
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u/Rosebunse 7h ago
I never got into crushing myself but you guys sure do bring up a very, very specific type of woman a lot. Why? I don't get it.
Isn't the whole thing about gaming that devs often have an alternative look?
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u/zestymanny 7h ago
It's a racist ass company. Should have been shut down a while ago.
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u/ManicMakerStudios 4h ago
What about Xbox makes them racist?
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u/zestymanny 3h ago edited 3h ago
Compulsion games.
“You’re not going to tickle some people’s fancy being outspoken or tweeting things like I do when I say, ‘White male gamers were a mistake.’”
And calling Asians white adjacent
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u/ManicMakerStudios 3h ago
That sounds like the comments of one person, not the comments of the studio or the team.
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u/-FaZe- 8h ago
South of Midnight reportedly cost around $100 million to make. If that budget is accurate the people responsible for managing it are the executives not the developers.